I wonder why they only used women for the study.
You have no idea how depressed this makes me.
1: Probably because detectable makeup would set off a strong social reaction, which would confuse the issue.
Paid for by Proctor and Gamble. There's no way to know how many experiments they did and buried before they got one that produced the results they like. For the sake of promoting scientific integrity you should ignore their results!
I wonder 1 too. Half of the argument back with Ogged is that make-up can be done inconspicuously.
Also, this study was not done in the region of the world where Ogged lived (the west coast from Santa Cruz to Vancouver).
Professional looks a lot better to me than glamorous.
I can't use an eyelash curler, and I haven't found a mascara for a while that doesn't smear.
Anything other than lipstick doesn't show up anymore except when I do up my eyes for night. Lipstick is visible. I need to get a warmer blush than the Nars one I have. Cream works well. I used to like custom color specialists a lot, but I kep my pot much too long.
Also it irritates me that "natural" is a look to be achieved with make-up.
Ridiculous. 149 people looked at pictures and made assessments about competency based on shiny faces, excuse me "varying intensities of luminance constrast." All of their judgments are going to be altered the minute a woman speaks, for better or worse.
Even subconsciously I can't imagine people thinking, "Yeah she says incredibly stupid things, but she's so shiny that she must know what she's talking about."
All of their judgments are going to be altered the minute a woman speaks
Or when they can see her butt. Either way.
alameida, do you have recommendations for brow pencils? Or do you prefer powder? I was looking at Benefit. One of the people at the threading place where I get my brows done (not as good as the nursing student who used to do it) said that I needed to uses something.
I used to wear makeup, and I need to get back in the habit of it. I feel better about myself if I put a little on.
I used to let my friend RM, who's a semi-well-known conceptual artist, do my makeup before we went out. It usually took a few drinks before I felt not-like-an-asshole*, but mostly was a lot of fun.
*It was often some Aladdin Sane-level crazy. And we'd, like, go out to dinner first.
I just cannot stop touching my face, so anytime I've worn make-up it's been gone within an hour or two. Except for once or twice when I've been a bridesmaid and had my make-up done along with the rest of the bridesmaids; then it stays.
I imagine that the competence effect goes away if, say, your boss walks by while you're applying makeup at your desk.
Fuck.
First impressions based on facial appearance occur automatically, are difficult to overcome, and impact decision-making.
That is the first sentence of the study.
You never get a second chance to make a first impression
1980s advertising slogan created by Procter & Gamble that funded the study.
I'm not sure what my point is, but this struck me as funny.
yeah, I maybe shouldn't have .... there.
The commandments of the patriarchs fathers of the Church are clear, brethren: Does not the Deuteronomathopedia say, Thou shalt not dally among the daughters of Jezebel, with their painted faces and not terribly flattering body-conscious evening wear? And does not Sheen say, My sister wears too eye makeup; people think she's a whore? Yea, and does not Slate's William Saletan say that surveys of symmetry assessment suffer from acute distortion because of ethno-racial distribution or something like that?
One of the people at the threading place where I get my brows done (not as good as the nursing student who used to do it) said that I needed to uses something.
Gah, I never trust recommendations like this from people involved in the beauty industry. Of course they're going to tell you that you need more stuff!
Wearing makeup has always felt so weird to me. I recognize that it isn't, that most women in the US wear at least some, at least some of the time, but every so often I'll put some lipstick on for a party or something and the whole concept (like, I'm painting colors on my face?) seems very strange.
I wonder about the observational effect or whatever it's called. I mean, the "Proctor & Gamble is hardly disinterested" criticism is obviously a big problem, but even if it wasn't, this is still apparently a situation where researchers recruited subjects, took them aside, flashed photos at them (probably on a screen, judging by "250 milliseconds") and asked them esoteric questions. What do competence and trustworthiness even mean in that context? Who could avoid second-guessing themselves in that situation? What does this have to do with how people actually interact in real life?
I go through periods of wearing makeup, but very little, so little that my compulsion to put it on is odd, because it can't be making that much of a difference. But I like maintaining the idea that it's weird, as per LB's 18 (like, I'm painting colors on my face?) , because why do we do that? Just... ugh.
I can't help but feel that the process described in the OP is rather haphazard, and that anyone with any commitment at all to beauty would color and shape each lash individually.
Apparently you can get them dyed (with vegetable-based dye instead of caustics, because ouch), which also sounds insane but much easier.
Oh no no. If you are truly committed, you wear those fake lashes that have to be glued on lash by lash.
I was traumatized by a story I once heard (actually, I suppose it could have been here) about someone who sneezed while curling her eyelashes and accidentally pulled all of them out.
When I went to the eye doctor to get new glasses, there were signs everywhere for the cream that makes your eyelashes thicker. Side effects may include changing the pigmentation in your iris.
I realize that the side effect is very very rare, but I'm okay with my light-colored thin eyelashes thank you very much.
Those rubber grippy things must really hold.
My dad used that medicine for something entirely unrelated that I can't remember now, but his lashes did indeed get thicker and more beautiful, and his eye color changed too.
25: Oh, right. It's a glaucoma medication, I think. People used to call the effect "glaucoma lashes" -- but now the fun is for everyone!
My parents had a dog with glaucoma. The dog had very nice eyes except for the cataracts.
My cousin did some sort of Latisse thing that was nominally for charity and involved regular Facebook updates about her eyelashes. This did nothing to dislodge her from the living-in-LA-and-therefore-superficial role she plays in my family.
My cousin did some sort of Latisse thing that was nominally for charity and involved regular Facebook updates about her eyelashes.
This world frightens and confuses me.
8 is silly.
This research seems a bit silly, too, but I don't think there's any reason to disbelieve its conclusions (which are that female faces with high luminance contrast presented briefly are rated as more competent, no more, no less).
If I was going to look for a meaningful confound I would look at the effect of age, of both the photographed women and the subjects. I'm not sure it would actually have that much effect, though. There's tons of evidence to the effect that high-contrast features are correlated with all kinds of positive (immediate) social judgments.
It seems to me I've heard conversations like this:
"She wasn't wearing any makeup."
"Yeah, that's unprofessional."
Isn't there a just an expectation in many work-situations that women will wear makeup? So, that a woman not wearing makeup will seem less competent just because she's not meeting social expectations?
I didn't read the link in the OP (shocking, I realize), so maybe this is addressed, but could it not be the case that our current standards of competence, amiability, etc. are flavored by our visual consumption of media faces? Not just actresses, but say, female TV news anchors.
They're made up to be particularly photogenic/telegenic; the subjects in the study were looking at photographs. Makeupless faces look washed out (without energy, pep, etc.) in photographs, unless they're fairly young people or are photographed in particular sorts of light. Makeup mimics youthfulness and that sort of light. I hypothesize.
In this case, the study's findings would just mean that we like the kind of made-up faces we've been trained to like.
In this case, the study's findings would just mean that we like the kind of made-up faces we've been trained to like.
That's certainly a plausible interpretation, but it's not relevant to the validity of the study's findings.
They're made up to be particularly photogenic/telegenic; the subjects in the study were looking at photographs. Makeupless faces look washed out (without energy, pep, etc.) in photographs, unless they're fairly young people or are photographed in particular sorts of light. Makeup mimics youthfulness and that sort of light. I hypothesize.
Well, see, here you're talking a whole other set of claims (what is "photogenic"? Why do makeupless faces look low energy? What is it about certain kinds of light that make people look better? What is it about makeup that makes people seem younger? Why would people who looked younger seem more competent?) that could be (actually that have been) empirically tested.
Why shouldn't people do things that make them look better? Admittedly that's not always the case for makeup, but if it were acceptable and I knew what I was doing I'd totally buy some cream for guys that increased my attractiveness and luminescence or whatever.
I think I'd favor mandatory makeup wearing, combined with state funded courses on correct application. Good personal aesthetics make the world a better place.
17: Rationally, I know that, but she wasn't selling anything and was recommending that I use the mascara that she presumed I had.
38: you could put more crap in your hair. Alternately, you could drive more of a Power Car.
Those boxes have been checked, my friend. Ok, not really, my hair is crap free and my car, while objectively EXTREMELY powerful, was featured as the "Dad" car on a recent commercial, which made me cry a little.
I bet your tie isn't even yellow.
but she wasn't selling anything
Even in that instance, with a person who does some sort of personal grooming/beauty-related thing for their job, I tend to assume that their bar for the amount of time/energy/money I am willing to put into such things is way higher than mine. Which is not to say that they never have good advice! Sometimes you're like, cool, I will start using my mascara for that, good idea.
37: what is "photogenic"?
If I knew that, I might look a lot better in photographs. Unless it took a lot of work.
What is it about makeup that makes people seem younger?
That one's not hard: it erases (fills in) lines and pores or temporarily tightens skins, covers over skin discolorations and undereye circles, adds a glow. That's straightforward.
Actually, I'm pretty sure that increasing the contrast in your features is a large part of the way that makeup makes people seem younger. I don't have a citation, but have definitely read about that.
That is not straightforward. How do you "tighten" skin without pulling on it? Does my skin shrink and contract for a variety of reasons and I don't notice it (except the obvious)? Also, what does "glow" mean for skin?
There are, presumably* very good veldty reasons why higher contrast facial features would score positively. Facial recognition, and so on.
* I've read pop-science stuff on this, but am prepared to be pwned by people who actually know stuff
44.last: what if you just use lipstick? Will that make you look younger? What about just lipstick and eye shadow?
re: 44.1
I couldn't tell you what makes someone photogenic per se, but it's not that hard to learn how to take photographs of people that make them look better. Longer focal length lenses, wider apertures, diffused light, and so on.
But it's also a youth signal, right? I thought that markedly lower contrast (of lips especially) was a thing that happens to some women with menopause.
There's a book chapter linked here that's probably pretty informative.
I thought low make up was supposed to mimic how you look when you're aroused. A little extra blood flow to the cheeks, lips, eyes a little more alert, etc.
Nobody can convince me that undereye concealer is not a godsend. I don't wear it everyday, but some mornings it can transform me from a death's head to something vaguely resembling a well-rested person. If I were a guy, I'd still want to wear undereye concealer.
In related news, the troops like eyebrow shaping.
I thought low make up was supposed to mimic how you look when you're aroused.
That's right, and that's also why (traditionally) women wear makeup and men don't. The male equalivent of make-up is walking around with a cucumber in your pocket.
If I were a guy, I'd still want to wear undereye concealer.
Halford, we can put together a plan for you. Then we're going to legally mandate that you follow it, you degenerate.
supposed to mimic how you look when you're aroused
56: not, per the papers/chapter linked in 51, necessarily.
56: Men's faces don't reflect arousal? Or is that women aren't looking there?
I'm totally game, but someone has to explain to me what underye concealer is, first.
60 is missing an "it". Also heterosexist.
Which is why I favor the state-mandated makeup application courses.
58: Probably most efficient if those just came glued to the shirt.
There are of course, now and historically, lots of societies in which men do wear make-up or otherwise adorn their faces/skin. Of course the veldt, as any fule kno, was exactly like 1950s Burbank.
66: And you were raised in one, if I remember correctly.
If I were a guy, I'd still want to wear undereye concealer.
I totally want to wear undereye concealer. Also do they make under-chin concealer?
Also do they make under-chin concealer?
A beard?
69: That's the purpose mine serves.
61: Seriously? ?
Uhhh, it's a skin-toned cream, sometimes coming in a wand form (the tube looks like a longer, thinner lipstick tube, roughly, and you withdraw from it a foam-tipped wand that's coated with the skin-toned makeup cream). You apply this moist cream to your undereye area and smooth it in. It's to blend with your surrounding skin tone, cover up the undereye circles. You can also apply this to other darkish areas on your face, say around your nostrils. It's sort of a quick version of foundation.
69: A woman to stand around and say, "no neck-wobble here."
It sounds like I can just use spackle and flesh-colored paint for plastic models to save money. I'll post about well that works.
re: 66
Well, I spent my mid-teens playing in bad 80s glam rock bands and wearing a metric ton of make-up, but I don't think central Scotland really qualifies.
You can also apply this to other darkish areas on your face
Like your pupils.
Also do they make under-chin concealer?
69: A beard?
Outdated ideas about gay people in the other thread, please.
As ugly as heterosexual chins can be, at least they serve a procreative purpose.
someone has to explain to me what underye [sic] concealer is
It's a flesh-colored layer to apply gently over the death-colored circles under your eyes. Some of the better brands will be subtly reflective, with wee little flakes of mica or titanium dioxide. If you apply too much, you get a weird goggles-tan effect, but a thin layer doesn't look like you're wearing makeup at all.*
*Yes, I remember this argument with ogged. I still maintain that there is a lot of makeup that is mostly imperceptible.
76: You laugh, John ...
shit. What's the line from Buckaroo Banzai?
Laugh-a while you can, monkey boy!
I'm totally game
Good. Cucumbers are paleo, right?
I think I stayed away from the argument with Ogged, but if he was maintaining that he could tell any time a woman was wearing makeup, he was wrong.
It's completely possible, and happens often, that a woman (and perhaps a man) wears makeup that's imperceptible yet improving. Undereye concealer being one of the greats. Smearcase should go for it.
82: Halford, I'd avoid the subtly reflective sparkly kinds. If I were you. Otherwise I don't see why not.
Although if he wants to pick up chicks by claiming to be the newfangled kind of vampire, it could help.
There's concealer marketed at men.
http://www.mankind.co.uk/health-beauty/skincare/concealers-cosmetics.list
Although if he wants to pick up chicks by claiming to be the newfangled kind of vampire, it could help.
With added excitement of the potential felony charge.
One word of warning: the concealer that markets itself as "blemish treatment" will often have some amount of salicylic acid. Not always the best stuff for fragile undereye skin.
88: True, I don't think Halford should wear fake perky nipples either. Unless his nipples are sensitive, but then, er, well, that's a pretty personal thing, and some people get pretty sensitive about it.
I'm suddenly worried that Halford's going to try to apply spackle to his delicate undereye area. Don't do that, Halford!
At my present trajectory, I'll be searching out underboob concealer in a couple of years.
92: Just clear your browser history and be done with it.
92: Please don't go for the analogue to the chin concealer.
Shave your chest and when your wife asks why, explain you did it for some woman on the internet.
I think Gaultier makes a whole line of men's cosmetics.
I've been snacking on almonds instead of Swedish Fish as part of my own personal quest to minimize male underboob. It kind of makes me want to stab people. The almonds don't taste bad or anything. It's just not the same.
You've grown boob hair long enough to grow down below the underboobs? Jeepers.
I love you anyway, so that's okay, but still, I think we need to see a picture.
I keep telling you to eat more bacon to make you less stabby, but I'm like a meat-eating Cassandra shouting into the wind. This morning's breakfast: 3 bison sausages and 8 slices of bacon. It's keeping my skin tight and radiant.
Saudi Arabia is the middle east's largest cosmetics market.
http://www.arabianbusiness.com/brand-cosmetic-sales-set-rise-in-middle-east-403524.html
Not to put too fine a point on this, but isn't 100 the flatulence equivalent of surviving on nothing but onions?
100: I don't like microwave bacon or cold bacon and my office doesn't allow hot plates.
You've grown boob hair long enough to grow down below the underboobs? Jeepers.
The back-hair combover is the real trend.
103: I'm in a jerky of the month club. Almost bacon-good!
How much jerky do you get? A month is a long time.
Not enough, obviously. But you could always join several clubs.
Or the same club under different pseudonyms.
jerky of the month club
Wow, google suggests there are way more of these than I would have predicted. I expected 3-5. But there are, what, 50?
I feel badly that I may have seemed to scoff at any underboob hair that may be present among members of the commentariat. It is not so. Carry on.
Wolfram Alpha is even more useless than I would have predicted at answering the question "how many jerky of the month clubs are there?"
55: Ooh! Ooh! I just saw this on the subway the other day: three high school or maybe junior high boys, all with shaped eyebrows, and also carefully shaped/shaved hairlines. It was really weird. (To me.) I thought, "wait, is this a thing now?" and now I guess I know.
And I guess I also know about jerky-of-the-month clubs. So many things now these days.
I am not willing to accept that underboob hair is a thing now.
Or the same club under different pseudonyms.
Be careful, because they will resciss your ass without mercy if they find you're double-enrolled.
snacking on almonds instead of Swedish Fish as part of my own personal quest to minimize male underboob. It kind of makes me want to stab people.
For me it helps to have something sweet to go with it like a bit of sliced pineapple. I don't have any bison on hand but I did start the day with a medium rare ground beef patty topped with an egg over easy and it ruled.
I started the day with some squash flan. It totally ruled, and was very paleo.
Squash flan? Tell me more about that, please.
Looks like a souffle, basically? With some squash for heft?
Sounds like unsweetened pumpkin pie filling to me.
What ttaM said. How dare you use the same words to describe squash flan and the mighty eggburger.
55, 116: It's eyebrow "shaping" for men, is it?
I don't know how I feel about super shaped brows on men, but I think cleaning up could look totally natural. What I do know is that men with super bushy hair and unibrow should probably trim just a bit and wax/pluck/thread the middle. Older men with hair growing out of their ears and noses need to trim that too.
Before WWII, there was a huge semi-legal market for betting on political elections. Newspapers used to report on the betting odds in the years before good polling. The volume was way way larger than anything on InTrade, and, in some years (I think) roughly similar to the volume invested in major stock markets. Link here.
Squash flan? Tell me more about that, please.
Deborah Madison cookbook, the flans and timbales section. I would like my morning food to be eggier, and the veggies + eggs one did it for me. (I used chard, which I have a hard time with in other contexts. +eggs +nutmeg seems to make it palatable to me, huh.) This one with the squashes is too squashy and not eggy enough for me. But it is very squashy, and may prevent me from the otherwise inevitable pumpkin spice latte indulgence.
Thanks. Not as sweet as pumpkin pie filling, sounds like.
Right, since there's no extra sugar. I used an acorn and a butternut squash (both from our vegetable delivery), and the acron kept it from being too sweet. I froze about half of the roasted squash for later.
Do paleo people approve of squash? It seems . . . sweet and carby.
Paleo is fine with squash, and sweet potatoes, as well. Theoretically you should eat them shortly after working out. But with a caution if you're really trying for weight loss.
Our Neolithic ancestors only ate squash when they were planning to really work their core.
Yay! South Beach is against sweet potatoes.
132: If the unibrow is thick enough, it can make two monocles look like glasses.
140 -- you know it! Those dudes were ripped. Also, apparently there's a window of time shortly after working out when your body is best able to absorb carbs and turn them into muscle,or something.
Can you eat beets on the paleo plan?
There's not really one paleo plan, but Robb Wolf is totes cool with the beets.
What about sugar refined from beets?
Also, apparently there's a window of time shortly after working out when your body is best able to absorb carbs and turn them into muscle,or something.
Because science! Wait, no. Because MAMMOTH FIGHT!
What about sugar refined from beefs?
Get a herd of buffalo with diabetes and refine the urine.
I am against the notion that the unibrow must be plucked.
Just saying.
I mean, unless it's really, truly, a unibrow, unbroken, which would be a little weird, that's true. Now I'm confused.
I want Gandalf eyebrows so I'm waiting and not trimming.
In general, I have 70s notions that hair should be wild and free.
I'm writing a tenure letter for a colleague who I like and I'm having the damndest time making it meaningful and detailed. Ugh.
Get a herd of buffalo with diabetes and refine the urine.
It's a well-known fact that buffalo are the only mammals that don't pee. That's because you can't urinate in a buffalo herd.
156: Do they have distinctive eyebrows?
I'd say they're mirror images of each other.
156: "Fourteen-foot eight, Professor Cylopsanaut is known to fire tiny submarines, crewed by robots, from his second finger. That is not the only thing he emits, no: he also emits knowledge, focused and penetrating, that sweep floyd-show-laser-like over his rapt -- not to say insensate -- students."
men with super bushy hair and unibrow should probably trim just a bit and wax/pluck/thread the middle. Older men with hair growing out of their ears and noses need to trim that too.
At least she's off our case for a change.
I'm not technically old (by my own definition), but I would mount a fierce stand of nose hair if I wanted.
I can't wait to eat a Nazi cow. Hopefully soon!
You could eat a Nazi and a cow without waiting.
I would mount a fierce stand of nose hair if I wanted
Weirder than shoes cast in bronze, I tell you that. Would you just display it, or use it as a shaving brush?
Fourteen-foot eight, Professor Cylopsanaut is known to fire tiny submarines, crewed by robots, from his second finger.
Are we talking about something hard, six inches long, and full of robotic seamen?
Holy shit I am loving reading about the Auroch. I think reviving the Auroch will be my new crank interest.
Is it the Gulag Archipelago that starts with eating the frozen mammoth?
I knew somebody who was trying to make the perfect herd of cattle so if the Temple gets rebuilt, they* would pick a calf of one of his cows for a sacrifice. This turned out to be not a good financial plan.
*I don't know exactly who gets to pick.
I seem to remember that it was a fish caught in a 'lens of ice'.
What I do know is that men with super bushy hair and unibrow should probably trim just a bit and wax/pluck/thread the middle. Older men with hair growing out of their ears and noses need to trim that too.
My barber shaves the bridge of my nose and my earlobes, thins my eyebrows and rotates the edge of the clippers round each nostril. Doesn't everyone's?
Check out how awesome this is: the neo-Aurach vs. Wisent controversy:
Professor Z. Pucek of the Bialowieza Nature Preserve has characterized the Heck cattle as the "biggest scientific swindle of the 20th Century".[citation needed] Professor Pucek works as a conservationist specializing in the surviving native Wisent (European Bison) which is seen by some as competition to Heck cattle development. Heck cattle are considered by some the most suitable cattle breed for low intensity grazing systems in certain types of nature reserves, due to their ruggedness and lack of need for human care.[citation needed] Heck cattle today are propagated in some places to fulfill the role of extinct megafauna in the ecosystem. However, there is uncertainty as to what ecological niche the aurochs itself filled. Dr Frans Vera claims that the aurochs lived in open parkland and supports their inclusion in nature reserve management. Cis van Vuure, however, in his book, Retracing the Aurochs: History, Morphology and Ecology of an Extinct Wild Ox suggests that the aurochs dwelled in dense forests and marshes while the Wisent dwelled in the open landscape. Wisent supporters claim that Heck cattle landscape management is a public relations ploy in order to illegitimately garner support for Heck cattle at the expense of a genuine native species, the Wisent.
I say, protect them both and eat them both. I want my gigantic paleo proto cows!!!
170 -- their plan failed, because clearly the sacrifice called for an Auroch. I wonder if I could start to graze some Heck Cattle somewhere and get involved in the reviving the Auroch movement.
170: Wait, what? Are many (any?) Jews enthusiastic about returning to pre-rabbinic practices, blood sacrifice included?
How accurately could one recreate the genome of the common ancestor of several species?
173 is great: Just going for a trim, honey! None of this "salon" business for me, just the plain ol' barber, a man's man! Back in a jiff.
The very nice woman who cuts my hair sometimes, but not always, trims my eyebrows.
Ladies....
179 -- I don't know, but I'm about to contact SIERDA - Syndicat International pour l'Elevage, la Reconnaissance et le Développement de l'Aurochs-reconstitué (English: International Union for the Breeding, Reintroduction and Development of the Reconstructed Aurochs) to find out.
This Wikipedia page in French seems pretty detailed. Crank interest here I come!
182: Why? Why on earth?
183: There's a very impressive, almost complete aurochs skeleton in the national museum in Copenhagen, if you're heading that way.
BG, I have never been a brown pencil person, but my presumptive future sis in law is. I'll ask her if anyone particularly rocks it. no powder, though. honestly the mascara type seems best for reasons outlined above but I can imagine needing the adjunct of a very well-sharpened pencil in the appropriate shade.
23: I do, I just don't do it every day. two clumps (3 lashes each) on either side of the eye at the very outside. this is one of the things that boys really don't notice but it just makes them think you look hot.
halford, gatsby in japan (former maker of MANDOM) makes guy's cosmetics. but you should just go to sephora and get the 'makeup for ever' people to fix you. god, people, it's like a new world of amazing wonderfulness. they have the greatest foundation of all time, even better than that mousse from shu uemura. it applies with an expensive brush but is hella worth it. also, go buy whichever shade of yves st laurent touche eclat is the right one for your face. cause that's how they did it on the veldt. how can it be a concealer and a highlighter, you'll ask? just trust me on this one.
how can it be a concealer and a highlighter, you'll ask?
Nanoparticles!
I will commit to trying a makeup experiment in the next month. Also, has anyone here tried Zebu?
The girls selling makeup in Sephora stores and big department stores really trowel the stuff on.
Men wearing make-up can't be that far from mainstream, because I've heard one of the local morning radio talk guys discuss it, and says he puts on concealer on days he wants to look good.
184.1: Some involved in similar efforts were actively trying to facilitate the Second Coming. I don't know if this guy was with that group or not.
Ixnay on the troweling, for sure.
I'm not sure this is going in the best direction: do we want makeup and eyebrow "shaping" to become normal for all persons? I mean really?
Halford is a hollywood lawyer who does crossfit and the paleo diet, so it's not shocking that he might try makeup, more power to him, but I wouldn't want this to become a society-wide trend, if you see what I mean. Because we are all fine without putting paint on our faces.
Wrong. Everyone would benefit by people looking better, not just me. Anyhow, Parsi, what are your views on Aurochs?
Halford is a hollywood lawyer who does crossfit and the paleo diet, so it's not shocking that he might try makeup
Dude, I think she just called you gay.
Looks are important in a relative sense, not an absolute one. If everybody got lazy by an equal amount, nothing would change socially.
Wrong. Like art or music, the more beauty the better. It's like saying who cares about the Mona Lisa because everyone could just draw stick figures.
At least as far as makeup goes. Obviously, there are real gains for physical fitness. So, don't trip people who are jogging but do spill mustard on people who wear too nice of clothes.
It's like saying who cares about the Mona Lisa because everyone could just draw stick figures.
My theory says thing about the aesthetics of anything object. Just people.
Wrong. Like art or music, the more beauty the better
There is a contrary benefit, though, to not having to spend lots of time and money to count as merely non-slovenly by one's local norms.
Exactly. Put all the beauty in objects that don't have to be ready for work by 8:30.
So it's just money making and time pressure (8:30 am) over physical beauty, then. Sometimes I hate America.
Anyhow, Parsi, what are your views on Aurochs?
I didn't read a thing about them; I was worrying about OWS.
I was just going to get more sleep and maybe take up woodworking.
My theory says thing about the aesthetics of anything object. Just people.
Agree thing! Yes object? Yes.
So it's just money making and time pressure (8:30 am) over physical beauty, then. Sometimes I hate America.
Pbbt.
My relatively ungroomed pubes, FOR INSTANCE, like their America (the not so young and not on the dating market America) just fine, thank you.
My theory says thing about the aesthetics of anything object.
Do what?
My relatively ungroomed pubes
I AM THE 72.9 PERCENT
s/b "My theory says nothing about the aesthetics of any object."
Pubes are different. They're basically for yourself and (usually) one other person. A more beautiful external appearance brightens the day of everyone around you.
Who died and made you pants-dictator?
Pubes are different. They're basically for yourself and (usually) one other person.
Speak for yourself, dude.
Well, if you're a nudist you probably owe it to others to be attentive to your pubes.
Having meticulously groomed pubes that weren't widely appreciated, or at least greatly appreciated by a small but discerning audience, would probably be depressing, like living in an extremely well-appointed and -decorated apartment that no else ever enters. Yeah, you can appreciate what you've done, but after enough time passes you stop even noticing yourself. (That''s an "ipse" and a "te", btw, it's a pun.) I mean, these beautification efforts are partly for yourself, but always (always! already!) also partly for a (perhaps as yet merely notional) spectator.
So what I'm saying here is, I'd like to invite you up to my apartment to see my decorations and/or my decorations.
A more beautiful external appearance brightens the day of everyone around you.
So do you really mean this which you have repeated like four (4) times now, or are you trolling?
So do you really mean this which you have repeated like four (4) times now, or are you trolling?
Clearly he can't really mean it, because it probably doesn't "brighten" (offensive verb!) the day of the blind.
Of course I mean that. It's absolutely true. Isn't your day improved by seeing attractive people?
Frequently my day is improved, in a fashion, by seeing attractive people, but also made worse, in a different fashion, by that numerically identical* seeing.
*that's for you, DS.
to see my decorations and/or my decorations.
nosflow has disco balls. c'mon, we all knew it.
221: Right, but it isn't improved by enough to offset the annoyance at my having to improve my appearance to not look out of place.
The hyphens in "well-appointed and -decorated" are not actually necessary. My apologies to Sir Kraab.
222: Frequently my day is improved, in a fashion, by seeing attractive people, but also made worse, in a different fashion, by that [same]* seeing.
I agree with nosflow. Particularly if attractive people are taken to be those who are enhanced by makeup, wearing carefully selected enhancing clothing, and so on, well look: we are not, as persons, canvasses chiefly to be presented to others as attractive things.
* apologies, neb; I substituted "same" for "numerically identical" for readability
I don't know how I feel about super shaped brows on men
I think the difference between brow shaping and unibrow busting/nosehair pruning is kind of like the difference between plastic surgery and wearing makeup. The one makes you look like somebody else, the other just makes you look like a better version of yourself.
I have a dear friend and coworker, a bit of a metrosexual, with a big ol' Italian unibrow. His wife fixes it, but every couple of cycles somebody gets carried away and he shows up to work looking... different. I always think of the first time I picked my mother up at the airport after her facelift and I thought, who the fuck is this lady?
228 just made me have a pretty helpless laughing fit. I think I need to wipe my eyes. Maybe go to bed.
The rigors of my Halloween schedule are requiring that I do this to my lovely beard.
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161: OFLs, if you want to criticize me like that, I'd appreciate it if you would not do it anonymously. An off-blog e-mail expressing your concerns would be even better. I realize that unfogged is not a warm and fuzzy place but you're not making your point effectively by being cruel unless your only intent is to hurt me personally.
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232: While I prefer sniping not to be anonymous, the earlier comment 161 responds could have been expected to hurt people's feelings as well.
Reference the Catholic guy breeding special Jewish cows for Temple consecrating, it's a big deal among Christians of the type who want to bring about the end of the world. If the Temple isn't rebuilt, then the world won't end. If the Jews aren't ritually purified (yes, really) then they can't rebuild the Temple. And, as you all know, you can't ritually purify an Israeli construction worker unless you have a red heifer calf, a pile of cedar logs, some firelighters (or crumpled newspaper), a box of matches, some hyssop and a bit of string. Now, you may want to ask an adult to help you with the next part.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/apocalypse/readings/forcing.html
(The chap referred to here is a Pentecostalist.)
178: The consecration of the new temple requires (IIRC) the sacrifice of a perfect red heifer. I do remember clearly that the criterion for perfection in redness is no more than six non-red hairs on its body. I've heard of an evangelical christian who is trying to breed this thing and has the cooperation of some orthodox rabbis - an article about the guy is where I read the six hairs thing. It might be the same person referred to in 170.
Also, if we're going to bring back paleolithic beasties I say fuck the Aurochs and bring back the Pygmy Mammoth. I want one for a pet so I can brush its hair and put little ribbons on its tail and wash it in the garden with a hose while it runs around squealing with delight. In the winter I will harness a sled to it and we will go out in the snow to have adventures together. I will take it to the park and let little children ride around on it.
Seriously. Get on this, science people! This is important!!
It will help me get over the pwnage of 234, too.
Red coos already exist, no? Or do the big hairy horned variety not count?
237: I love those emo-haircut Scottish cows!
237 - I am no expert on either cows or Jewish holy law, but perhaps the less than six non-red hairs thing is the killer. Could be that it's not hard at all to find a suitable cow but the guy wants something to make him feel important and he likes cows so he's making it out to be more difficult than it is. There's not a lot of things that combine cows and cosmic battles between good and evil.
I think it has to be absolutely pure red, as togolosh says: highland cattle tend to have different coloured bits, in particular what I can only describe as blonde highlights.
oudemia would get on well with my nephew, who only has to see a highland cow to stand up (inasmuch as he is able) and start making rapturous OO OO OO noises like a small delighted orangutan.
togolosh has pwned me! And thus is equilibrium maintained.
I confess, I've taken to shaving through my unibrow and trimming my nose hairs, and I don't even have the "old man" excuse. However, some of my eyebrow hairs were growing so long that they were getting in my eyes. Once I went out and bought and learned to use the appliance to fix that, it's just another couple minutes to take care of the more cosmetic stuff...
235: Not the same person, probably. This guy never got too far.
I say fuck the Aurochs and bring back the Pygmy Mammoth.
There are more conventional methods.
