Also, absolutely dry lettuce lets the oil cling.
I've never heard of a vinegar and oil dressing that wasn't mixed before it is put on the lettuce. I've always seen them shaken together first.
Yes, I define "vinaigrette" as something that exists as a liquid prior to the pouring and tossing.
Vinaigrette is made in a bowl, with a whisk. That is all.
Why can't you just shake it in a jar? That's the only way I can get it to emulsify without getting dressing on a shirt.
5: YES. VINAIGRETTE IS PROPERLY SHAKEN, NOT STIRRED.
Use a bigger bowl or a smaller whisk.
I'm not buying another whisk. Having more than one whisk is crossing some line or another that I just don't want to cross. It's like buying a Beemer or giving money to NPR.
Or a jar. You could also use a jar.
Maybe I could weld six forks together.
My 30 year-old roommate asked me how to make vinaigrette a couple of days ago.
11. Are you using a mechanical whisk to make vinaigrette? Total overkill. If you put the oil and vinegar in a bowl and beat them with a fork or a balloon whisk for thirty seconds you get a perfectly good emulsion. I have in fact made mayonnaise with a balloon whisk - it's all there was. It's a bit of a pain, but it's not that difficult.
Or whatever container with a lid I'm planning on using to serve the dressing in.
Seriously, a jar is a thousand times easier than a whisk.
Even if you do the whisking without incident, you still have to wash the whisk and the bowl. Who has that kind of free time.
IME the whisking and reverse mayo technique (emulsifying the vinegar/acid a little at a time) works better for having a dressing that stays emulsified. If'you're going to use it all that night, the jar thing is fine.
I've done the deconstructed thing Stanley's talking about, but I don't like it.
Even if you mix them thoroughly, they will separate over the course of a day in the fridge, right? I'd like to know if there's something I'm doing wrong.
I don't know what to say about the soy sauce option in the OP. A bit of mustard (not yellow) can be helpful. Depends on what kinds of vinegar and oil you're using.
Having more than one whisk is crossing some line or another that I just don't want to cross.
If you make pan sauces, a gravy whisk is quite useful.
I have never gotten an emulsion with a jar. It separates quite quickly. A whisk might work better, I guess (I too have made mayo with a whisk), but I'd still think that you'd have to do the whole painful adding the oil a bit at a time thing.
It doesn't matter to me, though, because I have an immersion blender which drastically reduces the overkill-ness of using a blender in the first place.
If you make pan sauces, a gravy whisk is quite useful.
The flat kind that looks kind of like a cocktail strainer? Yeah.
19: Not doing anything wrong as far as I know. They'll separate. Just shake/fork/whisk them again, no harm or foul.
Mayonnaise is different, as is caesar dressing: the egg keeps them from separating again later, I don't know why.
I will sometimes add a spoonful or two of plain yogurt to a vinegar and oil dressing. Besides making it a touch creamy, it also makes it come together more easily. Those little battery-powered wire thingies for frothing milk will also emulsify your dressing quite nicely.
24: I have the kind that's just flat, but I would like to try one with the coiled wire.
Oh, dear. I'm mostly going to stay away from this thread, since I'm growing a little tired of having my culinary habits relentlessly mocked in this forum, but I will say that I had no idea that, when dealing with vinaigrettes, emulsification was a goal. I thought people put the oil and the vinegar together in a jar and shook them prior to pouring just because that's faster and easier than pouring separately from two jars. I mostly just pour separately from two jars.
So... if you blend them vigorously (as with a whisk), they'll emulsify? Does that noticeably improve the flavor of the end result?
I think the goal is just to have them as well combined as possible. If you can get it emulsified, great! If not, just having them well mixed for the purposes of getting them evenly over the salad is fine.
I wouldn't worry about it, urple. Emulsification is helpful if you want to make the dressing in advance, because an emulsified dressing won't separate into discrete oil-vinegar layers.
Shaking in a jar is still (IMO) preferable to pouring from separate jars, even if it doesn't create a long-lasting emulsification, because the ingredients become more evenly mixed. But there's nothing wrong with pouring from separate jars if you like the results. I sometimes do it myself! See, no worries.
28: keeps the ingredients together, and yes, that's better.
because an emulsified dressing won't separate into discrete oil-vinegar layers.
Actually it will, it just takes a little longer. You can't make a vinaigrette after breakfast and expect it to be still emulsified by dinner time (which isn't a problem, as you can easily beat it back up.) But it will last through dinner. There's a distinction between a temporary emulsion like a vinaigrette and a permanent emulsion like mayo. It's the eggs wot dunnit.
Ah, right. I usually put a healthy dollop of mustard in my salad dressings, which helps.
I save my healthy mustard for hot dogs and use the unhealthy stuff in dressings. It's mixed with other stuff so it doesn't matter as much.
Moby, there's a big difference between a healthy dollop of mustard and a dollop of healthy mustard.
Put me down a whisk fan. Jars are for people who like washing inside jars more than just shaking a whisk in some hot soapy water. Which strikes me as crazy, but whevs.
Also: mustard, maybe a little crushed garlic, some cracked black pepper, sea salt. minced herbs--you can distribute more than oil and vinegar in an emulsion.
Soy sauce doesn't strike me as crazy if you're going for umami in some kind of composed salAd. I've certainly minced an anchovy and whisked it in to achieve the same thing.
It never occurred to me to use the immersion blender for a vinaigrette. I'd have thought it would be too ... energetic, or something.
Actually, I don't usually make a large enough quantity to warrant an immersion blender. When I do, though, I'll try it.
It never occurred to me to use the immersion blender for a vinaigrette. I'd have thought it would be too ... energetic, or something.
I have similar thoughts about the fucksaw.
Ah, so mustard is an emulsifier. I thought it was just flavoring.
Mustard can even be a Colonel, if you're playing a not-very-fun board game.
41: And for some reason I think it should be a brown or stone-ground type of mustard because that promotes emulsification? Whereas plain yellow mustard is more vinegary (and seems watery), so is not really doing what you want.
Empiically that seems to be true, but I can't think why. In both cases they're a paste of ground up stuff and vinegar.
This is as good of a time as any for me to mention that I love mustard but I just don't get dijon mustard or those mustards that somebody made with something sweet.
45: How do you feel about dijonnaise? No, not the condiment; the song.
Tensioactive molecules!
[C]ooks know that mustard can be used to make emulsioned vinaigrettes, for mustard also contains tensioactive molecules that help to stabilize the sauce.
Apparently these tensioactive molecules coat the oil droplets and prevent them from fusing. Says Hervé This in Molecular Gastronomy: Exploring the Science of Flavor, which is definitely the best present I ever got for being in someone's wedding.
47. That's very interesting. But does brown mustard have more tensioactive molecules than yellow, as per parsimon at 43?
One of the most outspoken participants in Occupy Dublin is named Tentsy O'Activist. True story.
America's Test Kitchen tested* egg yolk, mustard, and mayo. They assert that the emulsifiers in egg yolk, phospholipids generally and lecithin specifically, work better than the complex polysaccharides in mustard. Since egg yolk scored poorly on taste they recommended 1/2 teaspoon of mayo (which also contains phospholipids) plus 1/2t Dijon mustard for flavor.
However, this was with high-quality ingredients and blenders.
*Login required; available on bugmenot.
39, 42: Col. Mustard with the fucksaw in the dressing room?
How could egg yolk score poorly while mayo scored well?
50: It doesn't surprise me at all that egg yolk and mayo have extra emulsification specialness, but you don't always want to be making an egg/mayo style vinaigrette. Often you positively do not want to be making that, so mustard it is!
52: Egg yolk emulsified better than mayo but the tasters didn't like the result.
Oh, you mean on taste. I don't know, I guess it's a compromise.
I use kraft dressing from a squeeze bottle
Of course.
54: No, I meant in emulsification powers. I didn't read the article, see.
Does anyone else find mayonnaise disgusting? Like, I cringe just writing the word.
58: Not quite as much as I used to, but yes, definitely.
58: Yes, yes, yes. Don't want to touch it or anything it has slimed, don't want to look at it or think about it. Ewwww.
My extreme fondness of mayo emerged from a childhood subjected to Miracle Whip.
My standard salad template does not involve making a vinaigrette. If there's a prominent planty but non-leafy ingredient(s) (e.g. onions, or apples, or pears, or carrots, or japanese turnips, or suchlike), I put that in the bottom of the bowl with a little salt and some vinegar, which said ingredient proceeds to soak up.
I then put lightly on top the (very thoroughly spun dry) leafy ingredient(s), and add good olive oil. I toss the leafy stuff gently with the olive oil to get it well-coated, taking care not to disturb the weightier layer still macerating in vinegar below. If I'm going for something thicker and creamier I'll also add a little plain yogurt or buttermilk. I'll put some salt and pepper and any dried herbs I want to use on the coated leaves, and usually microplane some parmesan on too, again very lightly tossing to distribute.
Only at this point do I then mix the two layers, drawing up the vinegar-soaked planty but non-leafy ingredients to mix with the oil-coated leafy stuff.
Finally I add any crunchy ingredient(s) (like toasted breadcrumbs or nuts, or croutons) and let that just sit on top. The crunchy stuff gets naturally distributed as the salad is being served into bowls.
It sounds complicated, but it's actually super fast and easy and the results are predictably delicious.
People who whine about mayo have never encountered salad cream. The condiment that put two generations of Brits of eating raw veg ever.
the (very thoroughly spun dry) leafy ingredient(s)
While preparing dinner one night this summer at Tweety's family's shack in Maine, I was musing about what people did before salad spinners. Turns out this puzzling wire contraption hanging on the wall there is an old school salad spinner, where you put the leaves inside and whirl it around yourself. Presumably outside?
Shake them in a colander, and then pile them onto a clean dishtowel, fold the corners together, and shake that is how I was taught. And do it an hour before dinner if possible.
...I was musing about what people did before salad spinners.
Mostly, watched VHS tapes and didn't eat leafy vegetables.
You can save time and the spinning step by not washing your vegetables.
what people did before salad spinners
Eat wet lettuce?
65. Works too. You need a whip cracking action to bring the leaves down at high speed. Did this for half my life.
67: Yes, please. It's cold in the fridge, and we long for a warmer home.
63: I love that stuff. I can see how someone might not, but I have the palate of a hyena, so.
I was musing about what people did before salad spinners
Stop musing and RTFA!
Turns out this puzzling wire contraption hanging on the wall there is an old school salad spinner, where you put the leaves inside and whirl it around yourself.
I've seen something like this. Is it on a chain and you whirl the basket of pre-salad around like a bullroarer?
Why does it matter if your greens are dry?
If the oil doesn't cling to the leaves, it just pools in the bottom of the bowl, so there's little point in even adding it.
But that brings up the major reason I prefer adding oil first, then the vinegar (or other acid, for example lemon juice), over mixing up a vinaigrette and then dumping that on the salad. I generally find that a salad coated in vinaigrette tastes predominantly like the vinaigrette, with the salad ingredients really just acting as a vehicle for the dressing. But if you've got really excellent salad greens (which I pretty much always do, either from my own garden or from the farm where I help out), then the coat-with-oil-then-add-vinegar method brings out the flavors of the ingredients themselves, rather than masking them.
Stop musing and RTFA!
I couldn't! No internet and no iPhone reception at Maineshack!
73: It wasn't on a chain, but it did have a long handle.
76 makes me want to try the MMMethod, but I often eat just greens with dressing, no non-leafy ingredients. Perhaps I should start adding carrots, since I'm having trouble keeping up with the amount of carrots our weekly delivery box brings us.
77: For just greens with dressing I put the leaves in the bowl, coat them with oil (and any salt, pepper, cheese, herbs, etc), then splash with vinegar.
I used to macerate the planty bits in a separate bowl and then dump them on top of the coated greens at the end, which of course works fine too, but uses an extra bowl.
Also, yesterday I made myself a delicious salad of the season's first frisee which I coated with olive oil and salt, then added some chopped up sardines (our co-op just started carrying this brand, and they're fantastic: super meaty and rich), capers, and toasted pine nuts, and squeezed some lemon over it all. Bacon or lardons would have been delicious too in place of or addition to the sardines.
Yum. I have a giant head of red leaf lettuce I am going to give oil + squeeze of lemon treatment tonight. To go with this standby.
My parents take a damp cloth and wrap their lettuce and let it sit in the fridge overnight to crisp. It's great. I recommend it.
82: After washing? In lieu of washing? What kind of lettuce?
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Argh. FedEx was supposed to deliver a package to my office today (new laptop), and they show as having had the receptionist sign for it, but the receptionist claims never to have seen it, and I went over the stack of packages with her and also didn't see it. Having the front-desk person sign in bulk for the morning's FedEx delivery (which seems to be the standard practice) seems to make the tracking kind of pointless - I'm afraid FedEx will just claim we must have lost it.
|>
Oh, and the MMMethod sounds exquisite.
The default salad dressing of my childhood was this.
86: I like that the first ingredients is Tomato Soup.
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Broadway blocked off by police. Twitter says someone's been shot near Ogawa Plaza.
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I'm liking M/tch's salad dressing approach. I used to go that route when using heavier greens (i.e. kale salad), and it's truly superior for fully coating the greens with oil + herbs + parmesan + chopped nuts, before incorporating the veggies. For some reason I've fallen off the habit, so yay M/tch for the reminder.
I think this has been addressed here before, but I'm still doubtful that rinsing vegetables with water does anything more than give the E. Coli a nice shine.
With that listeria outbreak they didn't advise everyone to just run their canteloupes under the faucet. It was more like burn down the kitchen and wipe you children's memories.
Light bleach solution followed by clean rinse is supposed to be the way.
That's more believable. How many people bleach their vegetables?
90: this was my position when this has come up previously, and I was so roundly denounced (where the hell were you?) that I assumed I must be wrong. I still don't really bother to rinse vegetables, though.
where the hell were you?
Do you really want me on your side in an argument?
You don't have to disinfect the vegetables. Just sluice enough germs away that the rest can be smacked by your immune system.
Well, yeah, so my interests may not align with the people eating salad.
82: After washing? In lieu of washing? What kind of lettuce?
Well, they like iceberg. So they just peel off the outermost leaves and consider it washed, I think. Then they wrap the rest of the head of lettuce in the damp dishcloth overnight.
I don't like to baby my immune system.
You should wash veggies to rinse/wash off other things as well. I use a veggie wash that purportedly gets rid of (mumble, some) pesticides -- it sudses up mildly and definitely washes off the waxy coating you get on some veggies.
You should wash veggies to rinse/wash off other things as well.
Like people who sneeze while shopping the produce aisle.
You must have been a real treat for your mom when she had to run into the store to get some food.
102: Seriously. Do you know how many people have colds/flu/walking pneumonia these days? It's coming out of their pores! Be careful out there.
For Romaine lettuce I think that we always used only the inside and didn't bother to wash it.
Boston/butter/bibb lettuce is usually pretty dirty. We dried it on paper towels.
Now, I'm lazy and buy the pre-washed stuff.
I'm still doubtful that rinsing vegetables with water does anything more than give the E. Coli a nice shine.
Most of my lettuce comes to me with dirt on it, so several rinses of water are necessary.
Some other recommended planty but non-leafy ingredients to soak in vinegar prior to mixing with the leafy stuff:
tomatoes (particularly if they're not very stellar ones, the vinegar soak really improves them; if they're really good as is I'll usually just coat them in olive oil along with the leafy stuff)
cucumbers (as with tomatoes, they taste great with vinegar, but really good fresh sweet ones are nice just with olive oil too)
beets (especially good with arugula + toasted walnuts + a tangy goat cheese or a blue cheese; add the nuts and cheese at the very end)
boiled potatoes (very good with any mild lettuce or with spinach; as with tomatoes, if they're really good fresh potatoes and I want to highlight their flavor I won't soak them in vinegar, just coat them with oil)
golden raisins (great with fresh spinach + sweet onions + pine nuts)
halved grapes (also very good in spinach salads)
sliced strawberries (again with the spinach)
blanched or roasted cauliflower
I would like to advocate the use of honey as well as mustard, or even straight white sugar in a vinaigrette. a small amount of sweetener vastly improves the dressing.
110. Depends what vinegar you use. We tend to use balsamic, so extra sugar would make it too sweet. But yes, you need it for most types.
cucumbers (as with tomatoes, they taste great with vinegar, but really good fresh sweet ones are nice just with olive oil too)
Delurking to say that Alameida knows whereof she speaks.
olive oil first? Definitely yes
soy sauce? No
balsamic vinegar? Awful, why not just use maple syrup
lemon? Acceptable but I don't like it, though necessary if using balsamic to cut the sweetness (which is just wrong in salads though I make an exception for mango slices)
garlic? Absolutely, as much as possible. Great substitute for salt (on everything) for those of us with high cholesterol.
Garlic and chocolate are the two universal ingredients - just about everything edible can be prepared in some way to go with one or the other. Though they're pretty disgusting together.
Garlic and chocolate are the two universal ingredients - just about everything edible can be prepared in some way to go with one or the other. Though they're pretty disgusting together.
Not if you add bacon.
Doesn't mole have garlic and chocolate and not bacon?
I keep trying to somehow write a comment that I love food with mole sauce, but that word is tainted for me now and it keeps looking ridiculous. (But I really, really love the sauce - it's my go-to order in Tex-mex restaurants.)
I always order food with mole sauce. The taint cooks out.
Mole taint is considered a delicacy in some countries.
And an expensive one at that, because it takes so many moles to make one serving.
Avogadros with mole sauce. Yum.
Actually my number is 88310 (or 88311).
Great substitute for salt (on everything) for those of us with high cholesterol.
Not to get all Halford on you, but what relationship does salt intake have with high cholesterol, or any level of cholesterol for that matter?
125: I don't know if there is any direct relationship, but there is an indirect link. If you have high blood pressure, you need to watch your salt intake. If you have high cholesterol, you are more likely to have high blood pressure than otherwise.
T'AIN'T NUTHIN' BUT A MOLE THANG.
125:
Sorry, I meant high blood pressure.
I didn't know that about mole (like mole poblano?). I've had it a couple of times as a sauce on chicken but I've never made it.
I can testify to the extreme deliciousness of M/tch's salads, so you should do whatever he says. Saladwise, anyway.
It puts the olive oil on its salad, or else it gets the hose again.