we discourage the less conventionally attractive from getting involved in politics.

Are you one of those people without a television?

Leaders do seem to be getting better looking these days.

1: I do not, in fact, own a television, but I live in a house that has a television. We mostly watch Jeopardy! and Antiques Roadshow.

Washington is Hollywood for ugly people.

You look at politicians from the '70s and they were pretty much of the same attractiveness as the ones we have now. You look at pop and rock musicians from the '70s and plenty of them are too ugly to be allowed even one hit single nowadays.

5: Nixon, Dole, Carter, Ford, etc. They were all goofy or outright ugly. Compare that to Romney/Ryan or Obama. They seem hotter and I don't think it's just the bad suits in the 70s. Biden doesn't count, since he was both in the 70's and now.

3: Then there's no excuse for you, is there?

Bob McDonnell is a politician who's conventionally attractive but in a creepy-plastic-man sort of way.

Somewhere in Charleston, Patrick Morrisey is crying, taking slugs from a bottle of Scotch and looking at a mirror through his tears.

9: Did you check out all the other 49 or just happen to know what he looks like?

7: I don't really follow you, text. You think that I must have been exposed to ugly politicians because I have a television, and therefore I can't possibly believe that we discourage ugly people from becoming politicians? Is that it?

10: I looked for a state famed for the attractiveness of its citizens.

Contestants on Jeopardy! are hotter too. Not sure about Antiques Roadshow.

Given the people who actually hold political office now, and those who previously held it during my life time, I think you would have to be either blind or a moron to say that unattractive people are discouraged from politics. That's all, Stanley.

After a relatively few generations of economic etc inequality,

elites

will start to be "better looking" in a definition of "better looking" defined by elites according to their attributes and accepted by their social inferiors. Inferiors may rise into elite social positions, but will often be the ones that look like the elites. Taller, better posture, clearer skin...they will also be more intelligent, more verbal, calmer and more charming. Thus is an inheritable caste system created and sustained by fair rules of meritocracy.

I could go on, but the subject, and the current intentional instance of the pattern, makes me fucking violent.

I could link to Michael Kinsley's "Triumph of the Right-Wing Dork" essay again, or you could just Google it yourselves.

That article made me want to vomit. Best not to link it.

It is possible both that the unattractive are discouraged from entering politics, and that there are many unattractive officeholders. They could be the ones who just didn't care or overcame the discouragement.

While the more attractive took paths that don't involve the unpleasantness of politics.

That possibility would require that the unattractive officeholders were exceptionally gifted at politics, much more than the average person who happens to be interested in politics and foolish or greedy enough to want to pursue that interest.

9: Patrick Morrisey is an ugly person's idea of what an attractive person's idea of an ugly person would be.

Throughout time the ugly and deformed have excelled at the art of manipulation known as politics. I cite Socrates (legendarily ugly, admittedly failed to evade charges brought against him but not clear that he wanted to), Richard III, and Iago as my evidence.

Also Claudius!

I dunno, Barry O. Pam Bondi's pretty hot.

Text is wrong here, but it's an understandable sort of wrong, because top-level politicians tend to be old folks, who are less attractive by conventional standards. The relevant comparison class is all other 60-year-olds, or whatever. Politicians are more attractive; they're clearly being selected for at least partially on that basis. Here's some evidence of the mechanism (voters preferring attractive candidates).

The obvious solution to this problem is left as an exercise for the reader.

But who's the least attractive AG? Mike DeWine? Cuccinelli is repellent, of course, but he's uglier on the inside than out.

Robert E. Cooper of TN has a kind of Alfred E. Neuman thing going on.

9 to 26.

Judging by the link in 24, I'm not sure Barry O is correct even on his own terms. All the female AGs look pretty attractive in those pictures. (I guess this is evidence for Stanley's theory in the OP.) Not to mention the smoldering good looks of Beau Biden. Rowr.

Not to mention the smoldering good looks of Beau Biden. Rowr.

Yeah, but he probably didn't want to make things all weird.

True, true.

The Vermont guy continues Vermont's proud tradition of ugly politicians. Mississippi's Jim Hood looks like his hair has traveled here from 1986. And then there's West Virginia's Patrick Morrissey, who looks like Chris Farley playing the attorney general's embarrassing brother.

Pam Bondi was apparently elected by the Fox News audience. She literally looks 20 years old in that photo. To be fair so does Kathleen Kane.

I'm going to go out on a crazy limb here, 32 comments in, and speculate that women might be held to a different standard than men.

If I said you had a beautiful standard, would you hold it against me?

Our fellow is nothing to write home about; not my fault as my candidate did not prevail.

One thing I found really striking about that list was how many states have elected AGs. Alaska is unusual in having very few statewide elected offices; basically all of the cabinet-level positions that are elected in most states are appointed by the governor here. This is more like the federal system, and I think it makes more sense.

Bob is right. Most of the people in the link at 24 are clones. There's a male type and a female type, sure, and they have different coloured wigs so you can tell them apart, but the only unique looking human beings turn out to come from Guam and Puerto Rico.

I think that is significant.

37. Also the Virgin Islands. How come they get an AG and not Samoa?

Samoa has one. Third from the top.

Oh right. Missed him because he's a clone (subtype: elderly, big grey hair)

30 would have been hilarious. "...oh, except for your kid, Joe. Rowr! Am I right, ladies and Anderson?" It would actually have been a case of someone Bidening Biden himself.

Nixon, Dole, Carter, Ford, etc. They were all goofy or outright ugly. Compare that to Romney/Ryan or Obama. They seem hotter and I don't think it's just the bad suits in the 70s.

On the other hand, Kennedy was generally thought to be handsome. Coolidge and Roosevelt appear obviously goofy or hideous. And I won't violate the sanctity of off-blog communication by naming the two commenters and one front-page poster who confessed at the last Fresh Salt meetup to tingly feelings about Chester A. Arthur.

Sorry, _don't_ appear obviously goofy or hideous, obvs.

Disturbingly, I just did a google search for "hottest US presidents" and the first image result is William Howard Taft.

Probably the ugliest President was Lincoln, of course, but it's considered impolite to point this out.

I can't see why you'd feel tingly about Arthur unless you had a fetish for weird facial hair, which is fine if that's your thing, but his grandson was quite a looker.

45.1: That's why everybody mentions the ending slavery thing first.

Dude was so ugly, when he got elected, half the states decided to leave the Union.

Disturbingly, I just did a google search for "hottest US presidents" and the first image result is William Howard Taft.

Governor-General of the Philippines is warm work.

I'm surprised to learn that chris y is Chester Arthur's grandson.

Huh, so Chester A. Arthur's grandson is Eskimo brothers with Walt Whitman and Alan Ginsburg. This has been an added value thread.

Also tbh and to the OP, there are almost no hot female politicians. If anything, it's a handicap. You do need a particular kind of Iron Lady/tough mom of business look, and you can't be obese. If anything I think male politicians are more likely to be conventionally attractive himbos, though there's a wide range there too.

there are almost no hot female politicians

Halford apparently has higher standards than I do.

Iron Lady/tough mom of business look

What? How is this not hot? Not photogenic, but interpersonally great.

Halford apparently has higher standards than I do.

Yours are flaccid from holding them against so many ladies.

As long as we're talking about ladies, here's some good news: Court Orders FDA to Remove All Restrictions on the Morning-After Pill.

It could be that the political life, the machinations, anger and fear that go along therewith, are uglifying, such that while attractive people are initially selected, they don't stay that way for long.

I have a theory that the most beautiful people are shuffled into subordinate positions for as long as possible, in the hope that they will sleep with more people that way.

Basically all US politicians look like cheesy casino singers* to me, except for BHO, who looks like he might actually be good.

*John Kerry. You know it makes sense.

It's the hairspray, Alex.

Right. Alex, stop inhaling hairspray.

The link on 24 seems to not work now. Has the National Association of Attorneys General mugshot page been overloaded by everyone trying to check out Kamala Harris's gams?

Also tbh and to the OP, there are almost no hot female politicians.

Surprised Halford would say this, as I would think he would have a major crush on Mary Bono Mack , steadfast IP warrior. Also, she's aging now, but Maria Cantwell was super cute in an ice queen kind of way. I had a very young (pre-sexual) crush on the evil queen in the original Disney version in 'Snow White' and Cantwell kind of reminds me of her.

You do need a particular kind of Iron Lady/tough mom of business look, and you can't be obese.

I give you Barbara Mikulski , the ugliest politician of any gender. Also supposed to be a holy terror to work for. And the first lesbian Senator, I assume.

Gee this comment thread is obnoxious.

Everything old is new again, heebie.

Fashion related, stores are actually using color descriptors like manatee grey? Heh.

The link in 24 is broken.

I have a hard time analyzing this storm just in terms of gender. Color and race is also involved. Like O KH identifies as black even though her black father was mostly absent; even more than O her good looks don't fit into the stereotypical All-American standard or even the Black standard. To the extent that their triumph is a triumph for people who don't quite look "normal" isn't it important to own not just their intelligence and accomplishment but also their attractiveness? To not let someone peg them into the "freaky looking but smart" box?

59 to 64. We have brought the American justice system to its knees with the sheer force of our lecherous mockery.

|| High drama in the MT lege right now. It's the deadline for certain Koch sponsored stuff to get done -- if it doesn't pass the Senate today, it dies. Republicans have a substantial majority in the Senate, but somehow the absence of a single Dem senator stops everything (he was there when they gavelled in, and can't be found now). So everyone is running around trying to figure out what to do. The absent senator is also a member of the Blackfeet tribal council, and may be going home to the Blackfeet Nation -- which might complicate efforts to force him back to Helena. Or maybe not.

It does seem crazy that one guy can leave and stop all activity. |>

|| It's a bunch of stuff, not all Koch, but the key is a set of referenda that if they pass the Senate get put on the ballot in 2014, and cannot be vetoed by our Dem gov. Getting rid of same day voter registration, banning abortion, and, I think, adopting a top two primary system (to wipe out the Dem party in the redder counties). |>

|| Apparently, the usual procedure after a recess, if anyone is missing, is to issue a call of the Senate, and send state police to fetch the absent members. It's a 3 hour drive from the capitol to Sen Augare's home in Blackfeet country (actually about 2.5 from Helena to the border). Unless he's on backroads. Noon tomorrow is the witching hour. |>

The updates are fun, thank you. Let us know what happens.

It is fun. Just one guy left and they have to stop the whole thing? And this hasn't come up before, caused them to say "the fuck?" and fix it?

Obviously, the best case would be if at 11:59 a.m. tomorrow, the majority leader asked a waiting state policemen if the missing senator could be found and, on hearing "no," ripped a mask off the his head to reveal that he was the missing senator all along.

Making me think I should watch "Heaven's Gate" although maybe that was Wyoming.

Filmed in Montana!

On the Blackfeet Nation, actually. Some of it anyway.

Twitter is full of joking 'he's with me' posts. Lunch at this place, taking a swim there, having a couple of beers at a local tavern.

Here's a picture in case you see him walking by your window.

With a face like that, he could be attorney general.

He certainly coordinates well with those nice green chairs.

So the Republican leader has convened the Senate anyway. Dems are shouting and refusing to vote. Gallery ordered cleared.

FOOD FIGHT!

I'm thrilled and amazed that the Dems were shouting and pounding on their desks. I'm a fan of hooting and hollering: we should be more like the British parliament in that respect.

79: I agree.

I had a long, elaborate dream that in part involved a giant fish named Tankela Merkel. I blame this thread.

It's probably worth noting that Obama did end up apologizing to Harris.

I'm in the "politicians aren't generally so good looking" camp. Virginia Postrel had an interesting discussion about this on her blog - ages ago. I can't remember if she argued there aren't many truly beautiful politicians in general or just female politicians. I suggested Jennifer Granholm as an exception, but I think the basic point holds. It's actually hard to get people to trust you if you're too beautiful and this is more true for women.

My google skills must be declining because I cannot find the original post. In my defense she has since written a number books and articles about beauty glamour and style, which tend to swamp silly blog posts. Here's this recent thing from thegarance @ Atlantic, though, making the point that any discussion of women's attractiveness (+ or -) tends to reduce their impression of competence.

I used to carpool to HS with Cuccinelli. I can only think of him as the sniveling twerp in the backseat. Now with added resonance of evil.