You know like just participate in the existing local govt for fucks sake, next muni already exist you self satisfied twit.
I don't want to go all Cotton Mather on the jejune bastard, but I closed tab on one link when I got to the sentence "I wanted to learn to live in [some crappy poor neighborhood], to be tough" and the other when the guy's desire to arrogate the moral authority of the poor got a little too self-satisfied.
It suffers from the weaknesses of a lot of moral rants, but he's basically right, so let us not judge too harshly, Increase.
By all means, let's all pile on against the guy who is less wrong than the rest, for he is still wrong on the internet.
6 gets it right. Fuck that dude. Will read the link in a minute.
Okay! First link is garbage. Moving on to second.
OH MY GOD second link is seriously total garbage! Unlike the rest of you gentrifiers when I moved to a poor neighborhood because I could afford it I wanted to understand the people who lived there. Come on with the self-deluding horseshit, chief.
I'm stilling signing up for an Evernote account.
I don't understand why you are mocking him. All the guy ever wanted to do was build virtual reality sculptures in the ghetto.
The problem F is that he is wrong quite fundamentally about the "usefulness" of his patronizing"solution". If this were Victorian Manchester then perhaps private charity and for profit targeting of the poor qua market would be the best we could hope for. I'd like to go on believing we've progressed a bit in creating a mechanism for addressing collective action problems.
Personally, I moved to the ghetto to understand it, but all I got was a beeping house behind me and a fear that I will never sleep again.
I'm glad you linked these; even though he has a human number of blind spots the general gist is important.
I think it ties back to the not-even-noticing-you-skated-through phenomenon discussed in the earlier thread.
IME techies are no better or worse than any other group of humans at being able to imagine themselves into another person's life. I have certainly had the experience of being told quite frankly that I didn't know what the salient problems of another group of people are.
The reason this matters is for more or less the reason that the OP guy alludes to -- if the problem the people around you have is related to picking up dry cleaning, then that will seem like a salient problem to you. If the problem they're having is constant low-level sexual harassment from their boss at McDonald's....you may not know it's a problem, much less have ideas for how to optimize a solution.
(And don't make assumptions is really key here; a while back there was a good piece on Racialicious by a person of color, about why Uber was so great --precisely BECAUSE it replaced a trying-to-hail-a-cab problem with guaranteed-ride-coming-to-get-me solution).
Techies look for tech-based solutions to things. Its what they do.
(Halford, as much as we may differ on some points, you have my profound sympathy about the noise. The worst, most teeth-grindingly frustrating noise I've ever heard is intermittent loud beeping of the type you describe.)
"They" includes me, obvs. My code is going to save the world.
Hopefully my code won't destroy it.
I mean, I guess.
Or maybe I'll just write a build script to compile the code that is going to save the world.
Actually I rather liked the first link. Until he got to the part about drinking a forty so you can learn what all you should code. Then it was stupid.
Should be "what app you should code" but the autocorrect works too, if a little southern in dialect.
There are worse ways than to decide what all to code than drinking a forty. Focus groups, for example.
The messenger is flawed! Come on.
I'd like to go on believing we've progressed a bit in creating a mechanism for addressing collective action problems.
Sure, but you have to spark some little bit of civic consciousness first, I think. Otherwise, I'm not sure involvement would be such a good thing. I mean, these are people who talk about "voice and exit" and think "exit" is awesome.
9: Tweety gets it. What's wrong with the rest of you?
Seriously, I'm as mute as the next guilty white liberal facing a rant (or, in the case of TNC, a dirge) from a person of color, but (paraphrasing George Wallace, guiltily) I'll be damned if I let another honky out-"I know what it's like to be poor" or out-"I lived in a crappy neighborhood" me.
I mean, these are people who talk about "voice and exit" and think "exit" is awesome.
This is disturbingly well-put.
Sure, but you have to spark some little bit of civic consciousness first, I think. Otherwise, I'm not sure involvement would be such a good thing. I mean, these are people who talk about "voice and exit" and think "exit" is awesome
Fact and fact.
It suffers from the weaknesses of a lot of moral rants . . .
This thread does make me feel better about the reactions to the rant that I had recommended in the earlier thread . . .
I mean, these are people who talk about "voice and exit" and think "exit" is awesome.
I was just reading the summary of Exit Voice And Loyalty recently and was interested that it contrasts "exit" as the logic of economics and the marketplace with "voice" as the logic of politics. Put that way I think it's a nice description of the tensions between economics and politics and also not at all surprising that some people would prefer to interact with their local government and community as if they were a consumer.
The "flaw" is emblematic and pervasive. A spot of volunteering is going to magically counteract the self serving ideological commitments of our local titans and their hornswoggled employees? I don't think so.
Help organize classes to teach technology to people who can't even afford to go to community college. Help get Raspberry Pis or netbooks into schools that can barely afford textbooks.
Or, you know, help out on campaigns to better fund and support public education.
29: NO TEXTBOOKS FOR YOU. ONLY EMBEDDED PCs.
But with a raspberry pi you can flip your classroom.
30: TWO LAPTOPS PER CHILD! NAY, THREE! WE WILL PILE ON LAPTOPS UNTIL THE CHILD IS UPWARDLY MOBILE!
This guy seems to have his heart in the right place, and the problems he points to are very real, but the actual rants seem pretty misguided to me for the reasons others have pointed out. Mostly they seem overly focused on the personal qualities of the people involved and ignore structural issues that are much more important. That said, I've had very little interaction with these sorts of people myself so maybe ogged is right that this sort of thing is necessary to get their attention before they'll get on board with doing anything at all.
FREE BREAKFAST LAPTOP PROGRAM! LET NO CHILD BE HUNGRY WHEN THEY COULD BE EATING LAPTOPS!
Abandoning the other thread because too long to load workably on phone but sifu t nailed it early on observing that our burning man devoted bethren are not used to being seen as The Asshole Man. They are strongly attached to a self conception as "rebel disrupter" because "legalize pot yay" and jocks intimidated them in HS. If a bit of social opprobrium jolts some rethinking re the social compact and human dignity then let the opprobrium roll down.
36 is nice to say that I get it right, but mostly refers to things that I didn't actually -- wouldn't -- say.
37: you know, I'm not actually sure. Our neighborhood is definitely getting pricier but it doesn't seem exactly like there are long-time residents getting displaced, and more like long time residents are soaking up the equity and/or giving their properties to their successful, professional children. Also, there are a lot more white people in our immediate vicinity than I had necessarily realized.
Our old neighborhood was much more convincingly gentrifying (portuguese and brazilian families moving out, techies and biotechies, if that's a thing, moving in).
So you tried to gentrify, but failed. FIGURES.
Right? We did just move into a single family house immediately adjacent to an under-construction transit corridor, so there's that.
The discussion I was in about why schools having snow days is better for poor students was in The Other Place, but our school is closing tomorrow for drastically low temperatures and the message went out with a warning not to let children go outside. We've had far fewer closed days than neighboring schools because the people running the district are worried that more children will lack heat and food if they stay home than will be endangered or inconvenienced if they go to school. There's extra bussing for anyone who would normally walk, though people are clearly still walking. This isn't really "to" anything here, but in the same sort of semi-gentrified neighborhood.
Was referring only to your description of consternation of tech workers on finding themselves cast as villain oppressors, the balance of comment is mine.
The second piece is better than the first.
44: yeah but like the people I mentioned mostly haven't been to burning man (a couple have, I guess) and I've been, like, a lot. And actually a lot of the burners I know are borderline tiresomely interested in the application of technical-ish thinking to social justice problems (and have gotten involved in occupy and post-katrina things and I dunno that sort of business).
@Pittsburgh_Dad
I knew school was closed tomorrow when I came home and seen the damn Risk board was out.
So you tried to gentrify, but failed.
Oh yeah, absolutely. We looked at places in our old neighborhood and even put in a few offers before we realized that we were TOO LATE. We had been lulled into complacency by our stupid-low rent!
The weird thing is that this neighborhood has to be gentrifying, on some level. The overpriced artisanal butcher shop down the way would seem to guarantee as much. But the long-time residents we've met so far don't seem a bit bothered.
49: Maybe they're real old-timers from an indigenous vegan community.
49: Interestingly, one of the prime build-multi-unit-no-car-housing spots on my list used to be the site of a well-beloved traditional butcher shop. A hardware store is across the street, and there used to be a full-service supermarket (though a small one) across the street too, but it closed and is now a dollar store, I think. This is in a hip neighborhood, walking distance from just about any job downtown, and the lot has been vacant since before 2008. There's also a bunch of other prime redevelopment spots in the area too. My suspicion is that its *so* good that the owners are warehousing the land until they get offered a really ridiculous amount of money.
From the first link:
We can be heroes.
Just for one day.
Search through their one inch thoughts then decide it couldn't be done.
53: I know. What a really unfortunate choice of closing remark. I'm guessing that the writer is pretty young and it just beginning to think about things. So, you know, that's good.
No, he's been around a while, and as a journalist, wrote a pulitzer-nominated piece on the homeless in Vegas. He has an infelicitous style, partly because he's plays macho, partly because I think he's trying to pitch in his perceived audience's range, but that seems not so important. Maybe I'm wrong!
If he's speaking at an appropriate level for his audience, okay. Wouldn't want to spook 'em.
What do you call "itself" or "herself" at the end of a sentence as a...a...an...intensifier? I used to be good at describing these things. I think in French I'd call it a tonic pronoun maybe. Like "we weren't concerned with the thing itself." I'm trying to figure out whether Chicago Manual would want me to put a comma before it and I don't know what to google. Also, everyone is probably asleep. Help me Teo Wan Kenobi; you're my only hope.
What do you call "itself" or "herself" at the end of a sentence as a...a...an...intensifier? I used to be good at describing these things. I think in French I'd call it a tonic pronoun maybe. Like "we weren't concerned with the thing itself." I'm trying to figure out whether Chicago Manual would want me to put a comma before it and I don't know what to google. Also, everyone is probably asleep. Help me Teo Wan Kenobi; you're my only hope.
What do you call "itself" or "herself" at the end of a sentence as a...a...an...intensifier? I used to be good at describing these things. I think in French I'd call it a tonic pronoun maybe. Like "we weren't concerned with the thing itself." I'm trying to figure out whether Chicago Manual would want me to put a comma before it and I don't know what to google. Also, everyone is probably asleep. Help me Teo Wan Kenobi; you're my only hope.
Chicago Manual of Style deprecates triple posting as neither Chicagoan nor stylish.
Hm, I don't know of a specific term for that usage. The general term is "reflexive pronoun." I don't think a comma would be necessary under any style guide.
I'm a bit surprised that Code for America hasn't come up in recent threads, but then I don't know much about them. I think they're named after Teach for America but as far as I know they're at least not taking an existing profession and trying to de-professionalize it. Anyone have experience with them? They seem very civic minded, at least.
I keep meaning to go to CfA's meetups, but haven't yet. Maybe this Wednesday! ... Err, wait, no, already made other plans.
"the creative 1% are threatened"
65: Huh. Well, that does explain the weird focus on Danielle Steel in the original letter. The backstory on the hedge also explains a lot.
Also, Perkins apparently once killed a guy with his yacht.
58-59-60: Intensive pronoun (as opposed to reflexive pronoun). Adds intensity. No comma.
68, 69: Until he stepped in front of that yacht.
Does anyone have a guess what percent of the SV workforce is from outside US?
I'm a literal knight of the kingdom of Norway!
Halford, you gentrifying scum, instead of complaining about the beeping, why don't you buy yourself a forty and really listen to what it's saying?
MY WATCH CAN BUY A SIX-PACK OF YOUR WATCHES.
I thought the first link was inserted so we could discuss why sifu isn't doing more for the world.
68: I just went to look for video of Pete Seeger and Bruce Springstein performing "This Land is Your Land" on the Mall before the Inauguration. It turns out that the video is copyrighted by HBO and any independent hand-made video put up on the internet is being treated as though it were a violation of HBO's Copyright. (I don't know whether that's an accurate description of the actual law or just what's being done by youtube.) Given who Seeger was, that's just so sad.
77: Without lifetime + 70 years copyright laws that song and that performance never would have existed in the first place.
77: I blame Halford.
More seriously, Seeger was one of the very few people who could make my aggressive cynicism and general contempt for humanity feel foolish and small-minded.
77: I blame Halford.
More seriously, Seeger was one of the very few people who could make my aggressive cynicism and general contempt for humanity feel foolish and small-minded.
I have "Like a Rock" going through my head now, because I'm a bad person in terms of music appreciation.
Those watches are something else. 95% yttrium-stabilized zirconium used in its production
I mean, does anyone really expect a bunch of Indians and Chinese and Romanians to be "involved" in "the community"? The community that matters to them is thousands of miles away. The US is just a corporate campus and hotel until the next job.
Because nobody else has ever moved the fuck to here and done just that regardless of where they were from.
83, Being unhappy about something does not require one to be surprised that it's happening.
Who talked about surprise? Nobody's even mentioned it, and now it's inevitable and unsurprising?
It's not inevitable at all. I know dozens of people from India and China involved in my local community.
It's also not a particularly accurate description of what's going on with google and the other big companies in the valley.
77: I would blame Halford, but the video is right here on Youtube . Watch it, everybody!
I was there that day. It was truly inspiring. But I had a bad feeling even that day that we weren't going to be able to deal with the economic shitstorm rolling down on us.
I've never been to the valley. The only time I was ever out that way, I went to Napa.
That song should so be our national anthem. Sigh.
83: I can tell you that foreign employees tend to process that "tech workers get out" sentiment more as xenophobia/racism than class resentment/cultural condescension (which is how it feels to me, because white privelege).
@89 Maybe so, but is it some part of what's going on?
91: unless you work there and/or are really excited about the winchester mystery house there's not much reason to go to the valley.
I don't regret going to where the wine is instead.
93: And I think they have good reason to do so.
The thing that always bugs me about my visits to a certain lab in SV is that I can't walk to any food source. And on the weekends they don't run their free shuttle service. It's like they're trying to force everyone to drive.
Re 92, the thing I remember is when they went to those great last two verses -- the private property verse -- it kind of brought me up short. I hadn't been in DC long then but long enough to know that there was just no way this city was going to live up to that song.
Who doesn't want to make techies feel bad about preferring expensive booze which doesn't give them headaches? It would be nice if our newest crop of brilliant minds did something really smart to ameliorate poverty, but I think it's sort of silly for an old hippy to chastise them for not appearing on the brink of doing so, even if I enjoy reading his sentences (which I do). What would make things better? I don't pretend to have a specific answer, but it would probably require taking resources from rich people and giving them to poor people on a massive scale. Everything else is a hand-wringing competition.
OT: If one were Yglesias, one should hope to be sufficiently self-aware about throwing around bon mots like "unremarkable mediocrities."
Still, that's a good column he's got there.
90: I found that after I posted my comment. However, it seems to have been taken down from several sites.
I think Yglesias can, at this point, throw around bon mots if he likes.
Oh my God that Perkins interview is the best thing ever. "I'm a literal knight of the kingdom of Norway."
102: Curse you Unfogged! I'd gone cold turkey on reading Yggles for several years (since he moved to Slate), and now in a moment of weakness (actually combined boredom and procrastination) I clicked on the link.
Actually, the article reminds me that Yglesias is pretty good at the "Hey, this stupid thing that conservatives are saying/doing is pretty stupid" genre.
If only all of his employers would include a "No writing about education. Ever." clause in his contracts.
Am I the only one who feels disappointed when very rich people men* say the same things that one would expect of far less rich men? E.g., Bill "It's the same hamburger" Gates and Warren "I live in the same house" Buffett.** I much prefer it when the rich talk like they're just visiting from Scrooge McDuck's vault.
* Let's not kid ourselves. And that Australian woman is dull as exceptionally dull dishwater.
** Just kidding, Buff-dawg. You're my bro, notwithstanding those nightmares you gave me in 2008-9.
I don't remember seeing a Silicon Valley oligarch behave in exactly the same way as a Wall Street oligarch before. Most people who've heard about the Perkins story probably just assume he's one of those private equity or hedge fund guys, because those are always the people going on about how the whiny and useless peasants would be even worse off if we god-like supermen weren't around.
106: Yes Perkins does have confidence. We can give him that.
On a more constructive note, folks in the Bay Area should check out SPUR, http://www.spur.org/, and if so inclined, join. Heavens knows I don't agree with SPUR's official position on everything, but it is a great resource for information and I do support a great deal of its work (I am a member, and serve on a committee, although I am not on the board). The ED publishes semi-regularly on the Atlantic Cities site, including recently on affordable housing.
Re community involvement here in SF, I strongly encourage the tech savvy to look for opportunities to work with students in the SFUSD. I do ongoing mentoring/coaching work with students from a SF high school and it is really a wonderful experience. My volunteering is connected with my non-tech profession, but several students I work with have connections with local tech companies (square, eg), so I know the opportunities are there.
106: I didn't even know Rolexes came in six-packs.
109: Yes, you would almost think he was being ironic, if capable of that.
MY WATCH CAN BUY A SIX-PACK OF YOUR WATCHES.
In my case, this would mean that his watch costs about $60.
Actually, the article reminds me that Yglesias is pretty good at the "Hey, this stupid thing that conservatives are saying/doing is pretty stupid" genre.
Yeah, that really is his wheelhouse.
109: I was thinking that too. "Gosh, he sounds more like a private equity guy than a venture capitalist." When Romney was running for president, there was a segment on NPR about the difference between private equity and venture capital.
There was a woman whose job it was to write to news organizations every time someone referred to Romney as a venture capitalist. Implicitly they were saying that private equity people don't create much, and we VCs are useful.
