I demand that you rotate this post 180 degrees.
"In December, the judge ordered the pair to return $10.1 million to Borgata, reflecting the baccarat cash as well as $500,000 won using some of the winnings at craps."
I don't follow the Judge with respect to the craps part. He wouldn't be given a discount if he lost.
The bit about Sun spending "hundreds of hours" memorizing tiny flaws in Borgata playing cards as part of her plan to get revenge on the casino is great. It will make an awesome time-lapsed musical montage when they make the movie.
She seems to have been wealthy already, so it's a case of one rich grifter out to defraud other rich grifters. There's something very Trumpesque about the whole situation.
Ivey and Sun are truly the heroes America needs in these dark times.
2 is what I was thinking. Do casinos really want a rule that says it's a give-back if you use illegally-gotten money to gamble?
Such bullshit. If the roles were reversed and there were some technical flaw that favored the house, you can bet... well, a lot of money that I would not be able to sue them to retrieve my losses. In fact when they misconfigure their own slot machines they refuse to pay out any winnings in excess of what the average percentage is supposed to be.
4- Only if you win obviously. If you lose your illegally-gotten money, that's life.
I was thinking for that the person from whom the money was gotten illegally might use the precedent.
It is bullshit. If they didn't like him winning, they didn't have to take his business.
I can't understand from that article what the legal justification is here. I thought counting cards was legal, why is this any different? Isn't the casino supposed to just kick you out when they realize you're winning?
There is literally nothing I like more than a long-game revenge story. Thank you.
9: According to the decision, they knowingly engaged in a scheme to create and use a set of marked cards, and thus breached their contract with the Borgata to abide by NJ's casino law (which prohibits card-marking).
In an impressive display of chutzpah, the casino demanded not just Ivey's winnings, but also what Ivey would have lost if he'd been playing square (the judge didn't go that far).
Card counting is legal but casinos have the right to deny you service or set the terms of your play (e.g. you must keep the same bet the whole shoe and can't increase your bet when the count is hot.)
But aside from mafia tactics I've never heard of a casino demanding return of the winnings once they realize they've been had. That doesn't include the aforementioned refusal to pay out in the first place when a slot overhits.
11- Interesting. I don't frequent casinos but the one time I went to one I mostly watched and only played and lost a quarter*. Under that theory they should be able to charge me an hourly rate based on what I should have lost if I were an average gambler.
* Funny story is that I stood around watching then put a quarter in a cheap slot, lost it, and was done. On the elevator back up the party I was attending, someone asked me how I was doing, I said I lost a quarter, and he was totally bummed and sympathetic. I guess a quarter is slang for some larger amount like $250 or $2500?
It's $4,506. Gambling slang is weird.
uɐɯ 'ᴉnɥs ƃuǝɟ pɐq ƃuᴉʇɐǝɹɔ sᴉ puɐɯǝp ʎɯ oʇ ǝpǝɔɔɐ oʇ lɐsnɟǝɹ ɹno⅄
You're right, it is weird. A dollar is $100, but a dime is $1000 and a nickel is $500.
I'm worried you'll win all the comments, slol.
Everybody from Steubenville is a huge gambler. Not sure why.
I've said before that if I was in charge, casinos would not be allowed to exclude someone because they are winning. If someone can beat you at your game, you, the house, have to either pay up or stop playing that game with anyone.
Obviously, cheating under the announced terms of the game is different.
The article doesn't make it clear what the guy actually did - it sounds as though Sun did all the work and Ivey was just there to put on bets as instructed. Why didn't Sun just play by herself?
Because an Asian woman couldn't possibly be the protagonist of the crime caper screenplay which is the actual business plan. Duh.
re: 20
He was bank-rolling it? And maybe he has the mental maths skills -- as a super successful poker player -- to keep track of precisely what bets he needs to place, in response to the changing advantage they are getting when she knew that a high value card was coming up? It sounds like Sun wasn't as successful a gambler as Ivey.
I was going to send in this link, but it's topical here: 'Biggest Ad Fraud Ever': Hackers Make $5M A Day By Faking 300M Video Views - basically, they set up a bunch of bots to simulate users (investing a lot in mimicking clicks, human behavior, etc.), so they could sell online ad space which seemed to be exactly what advertisers were looking for in terms of target audience. Eventually, both the boot and the face will be automated, but the stamping is eternal.
22: I don't understand the exact mechanics either, but I figured it involved some aspect of counting cards in addition to the "marked" deck.
Plus, I bet you need to be a little bit famous (or have lost a ton of money prior) to get the casino to use your preferred brand of playing cards.
She tried to recruit Harrison Ford first, but when she was explaining when to raise the bet, he kept saying "Never tell me the odds."
The casino provided the cards, it's their negligence if they failed to check them for exploitable marks. It's not like Ivey marked the cards or provided them, if the casino has a problem they should sue the card manufacturer.
24: It has to involve card counting, too. I thought it'd give you some information about the dealer's current hand, but you put your bets in baccarat before the hands are dealt. But I'm still not seeing the process.
25.1 It might have been that story or the NYT one linked in that story but they purposely lost $100,000 to the casino as part of the set up.
In this case, I'd dismiss the casino's claim, and sanction them. If a player comes in and asks you to turn certain cards around, you do it, and they beat you because you did, you deserve all the loss you incur.
This decision is total bullshit and I expect he will win on appeal. Note that he hasn't actually been forced to give the money back yet.
OT, and sorry to interrupt this thread so early,but I have an EMERGENCY ATM. We have to discuss this article. Is this article a prank?!? I HAVE VIVID MEMORIES OF THIS MOVIE. I may lose my sanity, TODAY, unless someone explains to me what's going on.
31- Agreed. They said "Sinbad genie movie" and I pictured the cover before they described the cover then they said "Just kidding!"
31: I mentioned that at comment 70 in the TNC thread, but no one bit. It's bonkers, and trolling around the subreddit and some other Mandela Effect sites it's amazing how far people will go to not admit they misremembered something (or that a work of art can exist in multiple versions). On the other hand, it is amusing to discover what I misremembered, and am apparently not alone in: I thought Twilight Zone was narrated by Rod Sterling and that Peanuts was created by Charles Schultz. Also never noticed C-3P0's silver leg before.
I had a lot of fun with this one. It's clear that the movie still that they're aghast over has a prank Easter egg globe with Lemuria on it. Therefore someone moved New Zealand. Also like how someone forgot to closed their italics and screwed up all subsequent comments--it doesn't just happen here.
Everybody told me that the "That would be the butt, Bob" episode of the Newlywed Game didn't exist, but they were lying. Also, the Star Wars Holiday Special really existed.
When you say you have vivid memories, did you actually see the movie, so that you could describe the plot in detail? How old were you at time? And can you distinguish Shaq from non-giant humans?
I admittedly was confused because I thought the Shaq film was called "Shazam," but I might have just transposing the S form his other weird fantasy project, the Super Nintendo fighting game Shaq-Fu.
The article is confused. Shazaam was Shaquille O'Neil, not sinbad.
Oh, they clarify that at the end. The mass hallucination isn't the existence of the movie - just that everyone gets Sinbad and Shaq confused. Sad!
22: I think part of what made it work is that he fit the profile of a "whale" -- besides being a professional poker player, he's big gambler on more luck-based games like craps.
33: That article was very disturbing. Whenever I misremember something, I make jokes about being from a parallel universe. The idea that people think it for real...
I could buy mixing up Shaq and Sinbad, if both were dressed as genies and there were no scale reference. But I remembered (before reading the description) an image of the genie as described, arms crossed and looking skeptical, which is not what how Shaq is posed in the image. But there is such an image so maybe that's what I'm remembering.
37: Where "everyone" is white suburban children in the 90s who hadn't seen many black men with shaved heads. Probably further confused by Sinbad having a fantasy-sounding name--he took the name of The Sailor, how could he not have taken on a quasi-Arabian role?
Um, who created Peanuts then? (Did you mean George Schulz?) And who narrated The Twilight Zone? (WP says Serling narrated at least some of the time.)
41: I misspelt both names intentionally, spelling/pronouncing them in more common ways.
40- How dare you suggest Reddit is not a representative cross-section of societal diversity.
33.2 is terrific. A lot of people have bad memories and are also very invested in their memories being perfect.
I remember a Sinbad genie movie, although I never saw it. I would never confuse Shaq and Sinbad. Very strange. What's particularly strange is that I remember some sort of Sinbad/Phil Hartman collaboration, as the article purports this to be.
I checked IMDB to see if there was anything Sinbad might have been in that would be similar (after school TV?) and it turns out he is credited with once playing a condom.
I would have believed the Shaq movie was called Shazaam. I think Phil Hartman's character plays a genie in an ad in Newsradio and says Shazaam.
That's Dikkens with two ks, the well-known Dutch author.
45: They worked together on the movie Houseguest, which was apparently set and filmed here in in Pittsburgh.
Agree with C Carp if it was a breach of k case except the decision was based on a statutory violation, no? If he appeals he'll have to post a bond.
When you say you have vivid memories, did you actually see the movie, so that you could describe the plot in detail? How old were you at time? And can you distinguish Shaq from non-giant humans?
There is zero chance I could mix up Shaq and Sinbad. I was a big fan of both. I watched Sinbad's sitcom regularly. Shazaam, starring Sinbad, was one of my favorite movies. I've seen it a dozen+ times.
Whenever I misremember something, I make jokes about being from a parallel universe. The idea that people think it for real...
I've never even thought hard about the possibility of parallel universes, but I can much more easily believe in parallel universes than I can believe anybody who is trying to tell me that there only one universe and it's a universe in which Shazaam doesn't exist.
Did you remember Shazaam before or after eating food from the bulging cans?
I am emailing old friends with whom I watched the movie. Will report back.
Interesting. Can you describe the movie's plot?
With apologies to comrade Urple, I'm not really seeing what's interesting about this. Many people have remembered a movie called Kazaam starring Shaq as a movie called Shazaam starring Sinbad. Even if you had seen the Shaq movie, someone asking you, "hey, remember that Sinbad genie movie?" twenty years later could easily rejigger your memory to think it was Sinbad; ditto the title, obviously.
I think maybe Shaq wouldn't be so happy it was that easy for people to confuse him with Sinbad. Did he even lift?
I just caught a Charmander. On topic because it was outside the Chinese church.
57: I mean it's interesting that in the face of a preponderance of evidence he's willing to go to the mat for it and bring other friends in, given that I don't think he's gone down the rabbit hole. There's a degree of difference between "You remember that genie movie, with Sinbad?" "Oh yeah, I guess" and "There is no genie movie but Shazam, and Sinbad is its star."
This site really is entertaining:
I grew up in LA and always remember the sun setting between two buildings during the summer. One day in August, I noticed the sun had been setting way more North, on the right of the buildings . I asked my grandma about it and she was kind of confused but didn't say much.
In the 90s, the sun was warm and yellow. It gave everything that 90s glow, but now things feel different . I look at old pictures and that colour makes me nostalgic.
I remember the moon having a face of a woman, or a bunny, depending on what you focused on. It wasnt until a few months ago I went to look at the moon and realized the shadows had shifted. The face is only half showing and the rabbit is tilted.
I never heard of Supermoons until 2010? It was supposed to happen once every ( ) years? Now there are multiple supermoons a year!
There were NEVER chemtrails when I was growing up. No way. I was a daydreamy kid and was always looking at the sky. I started really noticing them around 2007? Maybe? All the clouds were different before chemtrails.
I'm pretty sure that's either trolling or an actual symptom.
Pages and pages like that--many people talk about the yellow moon turning into a white moon--Sepia-tinted memories, eh?--or the moon shifting angles, or changing where it sets. One person in MN thinks it sets in the northwest. Such a trainwreck. I can't stop reading, it's so amazing:
I'm dumbfounded. I have an advanced degree, many years of education, and have always had a keen interest in space. I have never in my life, until yesterday, heard that the moon is sometimes closer to earth and that it makes an elliptical orbit. This is entirely new information to me and like so many other perceived changes lately, it's blowing my mind.
Also never noticed C-3P0's silver leg before.
Damn! Was it always like that because they've changed all the images online the instant I searched.
Back in October I bought the 35th anniversary DVD of Halloween. For this edition, they recorded a new commentary with John Carpenter and Jamie Lee Curtis. It was great because they seemed to spend half of the commentary disagreeing about how they remembered things.
JLC: "This scene was our last day of shooting."
JC: "Are sure? I'm sure this was right near the beginning."
& etc.
