It seems like the question in the post title could be settled by a simple taste test.
a few, clear deaths taking priority over a large, amorphous, diffuse causality that is one factor affecting a huge number of deaths
Please tell me they're not anti-vaxxers.
Remember the not-Vonnegut commencement advice article/speech that went viral before virality was a thing?
Do other people do the 'wearing sunscreen daily even when it's not summer and you're not out in the sun all day' thing? I should if anyone should -- I'm fair and I burn easily and I've had skin cancer three times now (just basal cell. But I'm accumulating scars.) I just can't make myself do it.
The moisturiser I use has a sunscreen in it Admittedly, I forgot to put it on more often than I remember, so I'm sure I'm getting plenty of sun. But if I did remember ...
I mean, not-Vonnegut is a really big set.
And given the volume of carcinogens I've been breathing my whole life honestly why bother.
8: It's a good example of how stupid people were.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wear_Sunscreen
10: And yet people somehow seem to have managed to get even stupider.
Do other people do the 'wearing sunscreen daily even when it's not summer and you're not out in the sun all day' thing? I should if anyone should -- I'm fair and I burn easily and I've had skin cancer three times now (just basal cell. But I'm accumulating scars.) I just can't make myself do it.
Nope. Mainly because I rarely go outdoors for more than the time it takes to walk from one place to another, and certainly don't sunbathe, but really the only time I put on sunscreen is when skiing, or, very occasionally, when having a day in the park during summer.
There are a few days a year when I feel bad about this, but even on those days I doubt I'm spending more than 25 minutes outside over the course of a day anyway, and I'm actively seeking shade while I do so.
10: I think I've heard that. From Baz Luhrman, to unify threads.
I love the sun and hate sunscreen. When I was a kid, back before we knew the sun was not your friend, I'd get significant sunburns every summer. As an adult, I'd get a lot of outdoor exercise (tennis, especially), and never wear sunscreen.
I figure the damage is already done.
No problems so far. I've laid off a bit on sun exposure the last decade or so, and the little bit of sun skin damage I had has actually mostly repaired.
I suppose I don't have seasonal affective disorder, but exposure to the sun makes me happy. I ain't gonna give it up.
4: No, but I wore sunscreen whenever expecting to spend more than a half hour in the sun, any time of year. For now I'll be following the UV app instead.
I don't wear sunscreen very much except at the height of summer, but I have given up the struggle against hats, and now wear a fairly broad brimmed hat that works quite well to keep the sun off whenever I plan to be outside for a significant amount of time.
Do other people do the 'wearing sunscreen daily even when it's not summer and you're not out in the sun all day' thing?
I do, on uncovered skin, which is basically just my face in the winter, plus my arms in the summer (I don't bother with my hands because I figure hand-washing makes that silly). I also wear a wide-brimmed hat basically all the time outdoors (different summer and winter hats). I'm fair and have had several marginal moles removed.
I also got my Vitamin D levels tested last year, found out that it's officially low, and started supplementing. So I'm interested about this change of gestalt. I thought there was an interventional study from Scandinavia somewhere about Vitamin D that is somewhat at odds with what this article reports - Vitamin D supplementation did improve all-cause mortality. I'll need to go look it up again.
It sounds like, psychologically, one of those misleading situations that Thinking Fast & Slow loves: a very clearcut causality that accounts for a few, clear deaths taking priority over a large, amorphous, diffuse causality that is one factor affecting a huge number of deaths.
See also: e-scooters vs. cars.
Maybe that's wrong since the causality is just as clear with cars, it's just accepted as normal.
Vitamin D deficiency is endemic to the Middle East, I don't recall if it's something to do with Arabs or just the fact that you avoid the sun during the very long summers here. I got tested a couple of years ago and discovered I have a mild vitamin D deficiency. Which reminds me it's time to take my supplement.
4: yes. that article was useless to me - it didn't mention wrinkle avoidance once. when possible i expose my arms and legs to sun without sunscreen, and in SF this means much of the year i am bare legged and often bare armed when out in the sun. But my face, neck and backs of my hands, never willingly. at this point i'm not even sure my sun avoidance is vanity so much as pursuit of perhaps my longest continuously running hobby of competitive amateur wrinkle avoidance. unless reading counts as a hobby, in which case wrinkle avoidance comes in second.
The back of my hands look just awful.
I usually wear facial moisturizers with sunscreen. My sister had to have a pretty horrible topical treatment for skin cancer all over her face last year, which reminded me how important it is. I also have my moles checked annually because my genetic mutation may be linked to higher skin cancer risk.
I used to have the preternaturally youthful skin of a depressed shut-in but since I got a dog I've been aging like I drank from the wrong grail cup. If you want to keep getting carded into your forties stick with cat ownership.
Huh, I'm curious to know more about this "sunlight" thing, which maybe other Californians can explain to me: did it get banned in the East Bay because of the cancer issue, maybe at the end of 2018? I vaguely remember seeing things that looked like a large unusually bright star in the past, but not for weeks now. I hope they can review this new research and take another look at the legislative options before I crawl into my fucking closet and die of despair.
The article's fascinating. It seems plausible that the link between sun exposure and cancer is largely due to the habit of avoiding sun exposure except in relatively large doses (i.e., desk job with annual beach vacation.)
competitive amateur wrinkle avoidance
That's going to be a trial sport in the Tokyo Games.
I have given up the struggle against hats, and now wear a fairly broad brimmed hat that works quite well to keep the sun off whenever I plan to be outside for a significant amount of time.
I really wish hats would make a come back for men.
I really wish I could get over how ridiculous I look in a hat.
Vitamin D deficiency is endemic to the Middle East, I don't recall if it's something to do with Arabs or just the fact that you avoid the sun during the very long summers here.
Honestly, this makes me suspicious of how exactly they arrived at the numbers for correct Vitamin D levels and incorrect levels. Are they claiming Arabs have been deficient for thousands of years? Or that they're doing something differently recently?
Haven't they basically outsourced all manual labor and outdoor activities?
That is, in the gulf, excluding Yemen.
15: Yes, exactly, every word, me too.
I try not to get strong sunburns anymore, but you know, the way to prevent those is to have a base tan.
Now I'll read the article.
this makes me suspicious of how exactly they arrived at the numbers for correct Vitamin D levels and incorrect levels
There's a raging controversy about the minimum healthy level of Vitamin D, with some studies suggesting that the current minimum cut-off (20 ng/ml) should be lowered to 12.5 ng/ml and others that it should be raised to 30 ng/ml. If the lower level is correct, there isn't actually a Vitamin D deficiency pandemic at all.
I got a bit of a sunburn yesterday, skiing. It was glorious.
I guess I do wear sunscreen in the summer, and, if I remember, skiing in the sunshine. Which is not exactly regular here. Yesterday, very dense gray fog in the valley all day, but all completely below the bottom of the ski area, so it was blue ski and sunny.
Same thing today, although maybe the fog is just a bit higher: https://map.bloomsky.com/weather-stations/eaB1rJytnpS4n6ao
(That's a live cam, so if you look at the link in half an hour, it could well be different)
At 7:30 am today, it was 4F at the base of the ski hill and 32F at the top.
The base is about 1600 feet above the valley floor, and the top is 2600 feet above that.
More constructive responses than bitching about the weather:
1) this makes me feel better about my daughter's neglect of sunscreen at school;
2) I read the article but didn't get a very good sense of how much sunscreen itself was responsible for negating the health benefits of sun exposure. If you have two equally healthy, active populations that spend several hours a day outside, but one wears sunscreen assiduously and the other does not, is the sunscreen-wearing population significantly more likely to suffer from cardiovascular disease, depression, etc.? That would surprise me.
If "spend more time outside" becomes the latest thing your employer-based health insurance tries to force you to do, though, I will not protest. For the last year I've spent more days working in my home office (and less time outside at all) for a variety of reasons, and the episodic depression has been so bad that I'd give this sun-deficiency hypothesis serious consideration.
22: Yes. I would not mind exposing my arms but not my face. I'm not as good as I should be about my hands.
33; i've Read that it's a big problem for Muslim women in some countries, because their skin is never exposed.
In ng, minimum 25 vitamin D used to be 30, but is now 20. Nevertheless, there are people who advocate over 40.
There is also controversy over women's calcium RDA.
I take a Vitamin D supplement every day, and I've been reading more and more articles like the linked one, and I'm thinking of giving it up when my current supply is finished. I also take the other popular medication that is increasingly under suspicion: the once-a-day low dose aspirin. Having read recently that it is useless to possibly harmful (intestinal bleeding) if you haven't had heart issues, I may give that one up too. The NNT for it is something like 40,000.
On the other hand I do own stock in Caremark.
42 pwned by 37. That said, it used to be 30 and went down to 20. Was unaware of the 12.5 target, but there definitely are people who advocate 40.
I read 45 and thought "I can't hope to parse that density of upthread references".
39: You get inversions, too? It's fun to note sometimes that's it's 4 outside in town and 28 on the slopes.
18: I also got my Vitamin D levels tested last year, found out that it's officially low, and started supplementing. So I'm interested about this change of gestalt.
Count another one here, diagnosed a couple of months as officially Vitamin D deficient. I'm fair enough, and in younger days got (sometimes quite badly) sunburned enough, that I don't spend a lot of time in the sun to begin with, so I figured that explained it. I'm actually seeing my doctor tomorrow, and will ask for more details.
Thanks to Ume at 37 for the article.
I think the Violent Femmes were ahead of their time in terms of health science.
Re: vitamin D deficiency: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/10/health/vitamin-d-deficiency-supplements.html
ISTR based on the lower limit that you could get most of your daily VitD requirements from reflected sunlight - it wasn't necessary stand under direct sunlight.
|| "This was a family matter, a matter to be handled by the family or by the rabbis."
I don't quite know how the poor rabbis get dragged in but it somehow makes the line much funnier.
|>
I don't think Christie is revealing anything previously unknown. The purported quote from Kushner is weird but it too is from Christie who (a) hates him for good reason and (b) wasn't there.
I'm mildly amused that (he says) he was offered ambassadorships to Rome and the Vatican. Is there an unwritten rule somewhere that that's how you do a Catholic a solid?
54.1: actually Christie claims that he was there. No way of knowing of course.
'In one of the most visceral passages of the book, Christie recounts for the first time how Jared Kushner badmouthed him to Trump in April 2016, pleading with his father-in-law not to make Christie transition chairman. Remarkably, he did so while Christie was in the room.
'"He implied I had acted unethically and inappropriately but didn't state one fact to back that up," Christie writes. "Just a lot of feelings - very raw feelings that had been simmering for a dozen years."
"Kushner went on to tell Trump that it wasn't fair his father spent so long in prison. He insisted the sex tape and blackmailing was a family matter that should have been kept away from federal authorities: "This was a family matter, a matter to be handled by the family or by the rabbis."'
54.2: pretty sure it is: the Vatican ended up with one of Newt Gingrich's wives, didn't they?
I have to say when I saw a URL with Christie, Kushner and "hit job" I was about 50/50 on whether it was metaphorical.
54.1: I think I missed that in reading partly b/c so extremely implausible.
55.3: That's the other example I was thinking of.
It's funny how many of these books rely on Bannon as a source. Such an honest man!
My guess is that he's lied to Christie about this - of course, Kushner didn't want Christie in charge of the transition, but I'm betting Bannon was working against him too.
||
And... we officially have an ex-Withdrawal Agreement. 432 to 202.
|>
Nah, it's just Brexit going tits up again. Parliament rejected May's silly agreement by a 2/3 majority.
The betting is she wins the no-confidence vote, as the DUPs are supporting her. It's also interesting that apparently the Germans are open to new negotiations. Are they blinking first?
Heiko Maas specifically said they weren't!
25 or 6 to 4, speaking of upthread references.
62, 63: The middle is getting excluded, and the clock is ticking. Seventy-three days.
If I had anything to bet, I would be betting on no-deal Brexit, but that may just be me being extra cranky tonight. I mean, maybe more things can get sorted out in the transition period, and one of the EU's finer art is that of kicking the can down the road, but two years from invoking Article 50 is spelled out as clearly as nearly anything else in the Treaties.
Any one of the EU-27 governments can very reasonably take the position that it is impossible to negotiate with the UK government, even if it survives tomorrow's confidence vote, because it does not command a majority on the relevant issues. Indeed, all 27 EU governments could take that position. Why waste a moment of time on a counterparty that can't deliver its side of any bargain?
Even if there were great enthusiasm to re-open negotiations -- which there isn't, the UK had a hell of a lot of concessions even pre-Brexit, and there isn't anything that will satisfy the most ardent Brexiteers -- and even if the UK side knew what it wanted -- which it doesn't, and never has since the referendum -- and even if the UK side knew what it was doing -- which it hasn't at any step in the negotiations -- and even if the UK side took the negotiations seriously enough to do the necessary preparatory work -- which it hasn't for anything Brexit related -- seventy-three days are not enough.
I was surprised at the ruling that the UK could unilaterally uninvoke Article 50, though I am glad this escape hatch exists. I don't know who will open it, though.
Seventy-two days and seventy minutes. Tick, tick, tick.
How seldom I feel like I'm a responsible person - and yet it seems that I wear sunscreen more assiduously than most! Hooray for me.
1. I would love to have a broad-brimmed hat, but I have an enormous head and the only hats I can find that fit are your sort of yokelish men's outback hats which I reject on aesthetic grounds. If you have a large head and a large hat that is not utterly hideous, I would welcome recommendations.
2. The last ten years of UK history have been extraordinarily depressing. I mean, the bits before that were also depressing, but I feel like the workd of Thatcherism and the post-Thatcher "Labor" government have really born fruit in the past decade. When I was a young person, we just tended to assume that the UK was better than the US and wished in a vague sort of way that emmigration was possible. Now I'd rather stay here, and that's saying something.