Well, let me clarify: as an America-hating leftist, I think doing anything at all naughty to a big chain anything-store is a good thing. I think copying a recipe out of an unpurchased book is only mildly bad. On an absolute scale, you're only doing a little karmic damage, but as an America-hating leftist I am also a complete moral relativist so fuck the absolute viewpoint. You're gonna burn since you could have done a tiny good and instead did a tiny evil.
On preview: OK, you will burn when you do it tomorrow when the bookstore is open.
If you buy the magazine, you'll be funding Chris Kimball's bowtie collection, which is a menace that truly must be stopped.
I do have the option to do it at the big chain store, you know.
Does anyone know if Chris Kimball and Roger Kimball are related? I could believe it.
Insofar as being in a bookstore marginally increases your chances of making an impulse purchase of some sort, and it would be better to to give your impulse purchasing dollar ot the chain, it would be wrong not to copy the book from the chain store.
it would be better to to give your impulse purchasing dollar ot the chain
Say what?
Switch the store being described in the second two clauses from chain to indy. Freudian capitalist slip.
Fuck, I should have said something like "Friedmanian slip."
There are many recipes available online for free. Why thieve?
doing anything at all naughty to a big chain anything-store is a good thing
Steal the magazine from the big chain store, and then when you leave, set the store on fire.
11
What we need is a jokes-that-might-have-been blog.
Not all of us are interested in hot rancid ass, Brock.
What's so wonderful about the recipe?
max
['That you need to copy it?']
The ethical thing to do, of course, is to memorize the recipe in the store.
16: The recipes.
Probably nothing, really, that I couldn't find elsewhere, but I saw it there, and now that I've read them I don't want to forget them (in searching for Unf's post linked above I came across two food-related posts by Alameida and thought, I need to save these! Because otherwise they'll be LOST FOREVER!), and I'm not really that good a cook so I'm neurotic about tracking recipes (of course I'm also neurotic about music and books, so) and I have the naive hope that if I can just read enough I'll internalize The Principles and become a good cook, but that probably isn't true because I have a terrible memory and am completely disorganized.
You could copy the recipe, then sort a few books to make up for it, just around the cookbook section. Be inconspicuous about it.
Yeah, ben, and as you yourself said: "Just about any recipe you find on the net ... will stand you in good stead."
Seriously, what recipe are you wanting to steal? And what makes you think nothing comparable is this very moment just a google-search away?
To answer your question, though, it is about the same.
And how does this compare to copying it from a news stand? Do news stands even carry Cook's Illustrated?
I love that no one has suggested just buying the magazine.
I thought this is what libraries were invented for.
Has everyone already seen the Google recipe search? It's new to me.
And what makes you think nothing comparable is this very moment just a google-search away?
I'm sure that, if I could but frame the sort of recipe I wanted, I could find an adequate answer on the net. The issue, though, with "just google it" is that you have to know what it is you're googling before you're googling. Since specific recipes are often ones I wouldn't have thought of myself, I wouldn't think to google for them, and I'm not inclined to just browse through foodblogs for forever until one strikes my fancy (actually, I would be so inclined, I think, except I'd start getting upset that I was reading so many recipes that I could never keep track of, and would forget about, and never rediscover! Such is the inescapable sadness of my life. I think I actually did look through a few pages' worth of chocolate and zucchini once, even del.icio.us-ing some of the individual posts, but I never returned to them, no, never ever).
Some of the ones I was thinking of were just pasta sauces; it would be easy enough just to copy down the ingredients. I could reconstruct them passably from there.
Probably nothing, really, that I couldn't find elsewhere, but I saw it there, and now that I've read them I don't want to forget them (in searching for Unf's post linked above I came across two food-related posts by Alameida and thought, I need to save these! Because otherwise they'll be LOST FOREVER!), and I'm not really that good a cook so I'm neurotic about tracking recipes
Ben, old sod....what are the recipes for, roughly? No need to get specific, just sort of in the area.
Almost every recipe you ever saw (unless it's really nouveau-something or another, like asparagus and blue cheese pizza) has an immediate variant that is probably closer to the original whatever it was. So, unless it's something nastily modern original, a recipe can be had.
(of course I'm also neurotic about music and books, so) and I have the naive hope that if I can just read enough I'll internalize The Principles and become a good cook, but that probably isn't true because I have a terrible memory and am completely disorganized.
That's more or less how you do it. Sit down and draw 10,000 pictures and you be a lot better artist when you're done. Same with food.
max
['No need to get OCD about it tho.']
There is always a need to get OCD about it, though if I actually had OCD I suspect I'd be a little more organized.
I love that Ogged implicitly criticizes everyone for not having suggested just buying the magazine without actually suggesting just buying the magazine.
I fucked over two big chain stores this week.
First, my Powerbook's battery would not hold charge anymore after only a year of use. I was pissed, and I was hoping my battery was one of the recalled batteries. Alas, it was not to meant to be. So I decided to suck it up and pay out the 130 for a new battery. I go to a local Apple store and buy one. I was first sketched out because the receipt said that there wasn't a warranty and that no open box returns were allowed. I was also sketched out because the box had been opened and resealed with packing tape. I then freaked out when I opened the box and there was simply a dusty battery without packaging material or warranty info. I put the battery in the computer, and using Mac OS X hax0ring skills, I discover that the battery has been cycled almost 400 times and has only 0.2 amp-hours left (out of 4). I realized that someone must have pulled a switcheroo. I then call Apple demanding that they fix the shit, especially because I am leaving the country in a week. They say they cannot do anything and that I have to go back to the Apple store. I go back and return the thing, but they don't have any other powerbook batteries because of the recall. I call another store, and they say they have 6-8. I say to save one for me and that I will come tomorrow. I go the next day, but low and behold, there are no powerbook batteries. Now I am pissed because the store was about 30 miles away. The first store was also 10 miles away so I have been driving all over trying to find a fucking battery. I then have to drive another 30 miles north to go to another store and get a battery. I get the last one, go back to my car, pull the switcheroo with my old battery, then return it. So I got a powerbook battery for free, but Apple wasted about 2 hours of my time and about 100 miles of gasoline.
Just yesterday, by using Costco's liberal return policy, I returned an almost year old Casio S500 digital camera. I keep the 256 meg SD card. I then take my cash and buy a new Casio S600, which has more megapixels and a better LCD. I also got 20 bucks back because the S600 was cheaper than the S500. And now I have 512 megs of SD cards.
Less than ethical? Yes.
Do I regret it? No.
What max said. And since Cook's is more about The Principles than most other food mags, actually using the recipe is as grave an insult as stealing the issue itself. You should scan the recipe once, then try to make the dish. If you fail completely, you must then eat every last bit and send Chris Kimball a bow tie. You'll find that you become proficient in the kitchen in a very short time.
There is always a need to get OCD about it, though if I actually had OCD I suspect I'd be a little more organized.
Um, no? A person with OCD sees themselves as terribly disorganized even when they aren't. 'I just showered....AND I'M STILL COVERED IN SKIN BACTERIA! AGHHHHHHH!'
Even if it isn't that bad, you might still be going for the collectoritis thing.
max
['So what kind of tomato sauce?']
I think I know who wrote 31, unless its author deliberately his or her writing style.
35 -- I think what you want is "deliberately *mimicked*": You are saying that the writing style of 31 reminds you strongly of an Unfogged commenter's and positing that the commenter in question wrote 31. There is the possibility however that the author of 31 was not the commenter in question, but was imitating the style thereof.
Well, mimickry is one type of disguise.
The IP address used to post comment 31 does not match any other comment in the database, for what it's worth.
It was obviously apo, who is now trying to cover his ass.
Also, that should be a "c" in 37.
The IP address used to post comment 31 does not match any other comment in the database, for what it's worth.
But if you drop the last part of the IP address and search on that, you find a likely suspect.
The dread of OCD-McCarthyism overtakes us all!
max
['It ain't me, I ain't got a powerbook.']
Well, that clinches it. Definitely isn't me. Though I've worn out a couple of Powerbook batteries and find it pretty damn frustrating.
(I didn't really think it was you, Apo.)
39 should have said there need be no "k" in 37. I don't know why I thought there wasn't a "c". Remember, please, that I've been getting no sleep.
I'm so fricking burned out on Cook's Illustrated. Brine, brine, two-level fire, use high-quality ingredients, buy fancy equipment. There. Now you never have to read it again.
ben, are you more interested in learning to cook in general than in any specific recipe?
44 - That's exactly what Cook's Illustrated is. I like how they match the produce on the back page to the season, but have never subscribed 'cause they mostly cook meat.
No fair checking IP addresses.
Actually, I have nothing to hide. I paid cash for everything.
Brock: I am a very infrequent commenter here. Who do you think I sound like?
Man, that Costco return in 31 is fucking evil.
Enh, the Costco one isn't so bad. A 256MB SD card costs 15 bucks. It's the same as taking back clothes you don't like any more to fashion stores and buying new ones. Maybe Costco will pull a Best Buy and clamp down on their return policies, maybe not.
The first one is evil, as after experiencing just how fucking annoying it is to buy a battery and have it turn out to be a used one that someone returned, he went and did it to someone else. Also, the 0.2 aH almost certainly just meant that the battery wasn't fully charged, not that its capacity had fallen that far. But he should look on his receipt and see if it has the battery serial number.
Costco negotiates with their suppliers to provide their return policy. It's within the letter of the law. It might not be in the spirit of the law.
The battery was definitely cooked. It had about 380 cycles on it. And the capacity really was about 0.2 aH. I know this from using this: ioreg -w0 -l | grep Capacity in Terminal.
I only did the switcheroo because no one at Apple was willing to help me. HELL, when I returned the first dead battery, I told them it was defective. They didn't even bother to offer a replacement!!! Then the person at Apple tech support says he can't do anything besides sell me another battery. I said, I'm sorry, but I'm not buying another battery that may or may not work when I am leaving the country in a week.
Regarding the query posed by the post: it's a trick question! There's nothing wrong with either. So sayeth our intellectual property laws, which maintain that recipes can't be copyrighted.
Now, if you were instead, say, contemplating moving some songs from a CD you'd purchased onto your ipod... well, then you'd be in considerably murkier moral territory.
Maybe Costco will pull a Best Buy and clamp down on their return policies, maybe not.
That's exactly why it's evil. Chain stores are inevitable. Buying at Costco is spending your money with a company that voluntarily gives better wages, benefits, invites unions in at negotiation time, limits markup, etc. Taking advantage of them is just encouraging them to become like everyone else.
As of 10.4, this is in the System Profiler. But I only found that out thirty seconds ago.
Hold on, hold on. Let's not let this calumny in 44 stand uncontested. Cook's frequently tests equipment and recommends non-expensive items. Examples? Pyrex pie pans (ubiquitous and cheap), $25 chef's and bread knifes (as opposed to $100 Wusthofs and the like), and more that I can't think of without checking. The whole thing about Cook's is, no preconceived notions. For Christ's sake, they said Hunt's ketchup is better than Heinz! (they are grievously, horribly, almost unforgiveably wrong, but it's certainly not the expected/high-falutin' result. Also, they mock the idea of homemade ketchup).
But yes, they're brine-happy. And guests rave ceaselessly about my meat (I know, I know).
It's true, Megan (46), that they don't truck much with strictly veggie fare. But, frankly, unless you're making a moral stand, it's absurd to predicate recipes on "no meat products." It would be like having a rule against ground spices, or red food. If your goal is the best recipes, than even veggie dishes may end up with a little chicken broth.
That said, even as a chain-hater, I can't see a real difference. Although I'd probably choose to copy from the chain, in some vague hope that I'd be sticking it to The Man.
Commit to memory the layout of your kitchen. Head to one of the bookstores. Associate in your mind each recipe with a section of your kitchen and then associate each step of each recipe with an object in the corresponding section. Go home and recall the recipes by looking at your kitchen. No copying necessary.
Um, no? A person with OCD sees themselves as terribly disorganized even when they aren't.
I didn't say I'd see myself as being more organized.
Commit to memory the layout of your kitchen. Head to one of the bookstores. Associate in your mind each recipe with a section of your kitchen and then associate each step of each recipe with an object in the corresponding section. Go home and recall the recipes by looking at your kitchen. No copying necessary.
I've had it up to HERE with medieval/antique memory techniques! Up! to! here! I just got a (free!) copy of Lord Byron's Novel; maybe it, unlike the last four books by Crowley I've read, will be free of them.
Also, this is the moral equivalent of copying.
Re 45: I am generally more interested in Becoming a Better Cook than in any one particular recipe (I think I am generally competent enough that I can get away with not saying "learning to cook"). Vocabulary expansion, ect ect ect.
I've actually never tried those memory techniques. The only times I've memorized things I've done so through sheer force of will. Or, in the case of an English class where we somehow spent over 4 hours on a single, not very long poem, by accident.
"There's lots of double meanings."
I can only think of one. Two, if you really stretch it.
re: 55, 58 and 59
I bought a copy of Francis Yates' Art of Memory, read the first few chapters, put it away to pick it up a few days later and then forgot about it...
I have used those sorts of techniques once or twice in the past. Once, I suspect I put a big spike in the stats on a friend's psychology experiment on short-term/long-term memory. Generally though, as with 59, it's brute force memory for me.
Ben, if you can tell me what recipe you're looking for, I'd be happy to supply you with it from my very own copy of Cook's Illustrated.
Yes, I said it. I subscribe, and I'm not ashamed!
The least ethical thing in this thread is the behavior described in 38 and 40.
Or you could just go to their website and request a free trial issue.
I was going to agree with Megan's point about CI being meatcentric, but after grabbing a random issue from my carnivore sweetie's stash, I immediately found a non-meat recipe I want to try (German apple pancake, mm!)
Also, this:
More than 30 chickens and 90 lemons later, we found that when it comes to great roast lemon chicken, nothing beats a little squirt.
Oh dear.
51 vs. 20: Or use Google as a verb.
You're allowed to use "google" as a verb if you mean specifically to search using Google.
That is proprietarily silly logic unless it applies to all search engines. But I don't want to askjeeves for pork recipes, nor to yahoo a movie listing, nor to altavista former girlfriends. To google must be a generic verb or no verb at all.
Or you could log into the 14-day free trial over at Cook's Illustrated...
Or you could write down the title(s) of the recipe(s) and ask someone who pays for the magazine to scan it and e-mail it to you. Someone with a young chef in the house and far too many magazines.
66: The German Apple Pancake is fantastic, but make sure the pan's not too hot, or the bottom blackens before you can do anything about it.
58: I actually think Cook's is a splendid tool for the competent cook looking to take it to the next level. The thing is that their insane, anal methods are all explained, so you know what their culinary goal is, what worked, and why. So if you don't like the goal, you can adjust according to your own tastes/drudgery tolerance. I was, I think, a well above average cook when I started using Cook's a lot; there's no question that I'm now much, much better, whether using other cookbooks or improvising.
72: I just want to point out that I already offered this and have apparently been scorned. Scorned!
I wouldn't want to put anyone to trouble.
74: We shall have to teach young w-lfs-n not to scorn his betters. There is always that 800 degree oven...
Did w-lfs-n say "ect"? And did he say it three times? What is this world coming to?
Teach me not to keep my in-jokes straight, I guess.
JRoth--I'm burned out on CI because I've subscribed for 5 years--I feel like I know all their tricks. And brining is key when you're using supermarket pork and chicken.