Huh, I'm going skiing out in Idaho this March...hopefully the snow will stick around until then. Damn you , Global Warming!!!

Oh, it's pretty regional --- Whistler etc. have more snow than usual.

I learned to ski in California during the 1980s; I'm used to gravel and ice, and can't manage powder at all.

Same with me, I learned in VT on sheets of ice. I daydream about going out West sometime; powder sounds easier.

My dad noted over the holiday that the weather was lately returning to the milder temperatures they had when he was a kid. I know temperature variations are somewhat cyclical, but is this right, or just wishful thinking?

3, 4: Having grown up in what skiers call the Mid-Atlantic, my experience was the same. It's totally ruined me for powder. My one time skiing in the Alps sounded like this: wheeeeee!THUMP. wheeeeee!THUMP. At least I didn't fall down any crevasses.

powder can be hard work, when it's above knee high.

Yeah, it'll be interesting to see how different it feels; I've only done the small, icy mid-atlantic slopes. I'm looking forward to this "real" skiing I keep hearing about out west.

8: The big mountains are as much of a change as the snow consistency, I suspect. Snow is pretty variable anyway, you can get icy days out west too. But when you get a big dump ... well that's something else.

Did you see the article on the effect of Global Warming + El Nino in New York Magazine? I found this eerie:

The next time you're in Central Park, go up to Harlem Meer on the north end, then wander westward on the pathway into the heart of the park. After the first sharp turn, look off to the west and you'll see a thick stand of ash, its rough bark set off by delicate oval leaves. Long before New York existed, the ash thrived in this region, and the city's settlers used the tree's dense but springy wood to make everything from church pews to baseball bats. The ash has been here since the beginning.

But its time is about to come to an end. In recent years, foresters have quietly decided not to plant any new ash trees. Why? Because the city is becoming too warm and dry for them, and they're dying off. Green and white ash, our local varieties, are classified as "hardiness zone three or four," northern trees that prefer moist, well-drained soil. New York used to be like that, 200 years ago--but the temperature in the past century has risen over two degrees, and it's getting drier every year. "Last year we had stretches without rain that were practically six weeks long," says Neil Calvanese, vice-president of operations for the Central Park Conservancy, which maintains the park. And the warmer weather has introduced new wood-eating bugs that afflict the tree. Normally an ash will live 250 years, but this summer Calvanese had to chop down a majestic 130-footer when it stopped thriving. "Ash in the park," he says, "I really don't see as having much of a future."

So he's decided to let the ash slowly die off. An urban forester has to think decades into the future, and the city's only going to get hotter and hotter. Instead of the ash, city foresters are starting to plant trees like the persimmon, which thrives in southern climates like Washington's or even Atlanta's. Because that's what the future of New York looks like, weather-wise

I've been skiing in the East only once, a long time ago, and even though I was a kid back then, I was really underimpressed with the slopes: you end up spending most of the time on the lift or in line for it!

5: It is pretty regional, so it depends where you're from, I think. (I mean, the global average temperature stats are pretty clear, but that doesn't mean the trend is the same everywhere). But NY winters are way different now than when I was a kid (they actually seem snowier, but warmer. When I was a kid, gray piles of snow accumulated on the streets all winter -- they wouldn't melt away completely between Thanksgiving and Valentine's day. Now, we get plenty of snow, but it goes away -- you don't often get a full week that doesn't go above freezing), and the ones from when I was a kid were standard for as long as my parents can remember.

This about the ashes surprises me, since they're so common as to be pestilent around here, constantly sprouting, their canoe-paddle samaras literally thick on the ground. Is Chicago that much cooler than NYC?

While ashes are native to this area, the prairie fires before settlement kept them down. The tough-barked, fire-resistant trees, such as the Burr Oak and Shagbark Hickory, made little wooded stands still very visible today. The grasslands between them were called "oak openings." Now any stand of trees around here will have a high proportion of ashes.

Global warming doesn't mean everywhere gets warmer.* Because of the way weather patterns are interconnected it can mean an average rise but a drop in some specific areas. So even with a global rise in temperatures you might find loads of ski resorts with little or no snow and a few with more than before.

* On some models it's likely to make the UK massively colder. Scotland will be like northern Norway or northern Canada.

I hate GWB.

14: I forget who said it, but `The biggest mistake was naming it Global Warming, rather than Global Climate Change'.

On some models it's likely to make the UK massively colder.

Due to the collapse of the Gulf Stream, I think. That would certainly suck.

17: Isn't a lot of the UK pretty low-lying though? So no worries if it gets cold, it'll be under water anyway.

The gulf stream needn't collapse; if it just shifted a bit, Europe would be fucked.

16: I've heard my buddy Froz say it, but that probably isn't where you heard it.

21 Soon to be your buddy Thawd.

there's no indication of where it's going to end up or when it will stop.

Why would it ever stop?

re: 19

Yeah, with some bits having it easier than others. The UK would be particularly fucked given that it sits right in the gulf stream.

Most of Scotland is high enough to stick out the water even given higher water levels. It'll be a barren ice-ridden rock in the north, but it'll be there.

Northern Alberta is at 40 below right now.

The sections quoted in 10 is creepy because of the matter-of-factness of the quotes. "The banality of climate change."

24: sure, but it's winter.

No shit. (I wasn't intending it as a counterexample to global warming, just that my lumberjack is freezing his ass off.) And that maybe they should move the World Cup to Banff.

-40 is damn cold.

Coldest I've ever experienced was somewhere around -25 C [ ] and that was just SO cold.

27: Oh, I misread you. It's just that 40 or even 50 below is perfectly normal in the north. Sucks for your lumberjack though.

28: Most of the canadian *south* will regularly hit -25C in winter. You can still ride a bicycle in -25C.

(ok, you get strange looks ... but you can do it)

The coldest I can remember experiencing is ~10F, and that was probably accounting for the wind chill, but it was practically unbearable.

The bugger of it is that when the snow does hit us here, it will come all at once. So, the winter-sports regions get hit twice. First, the season openers go belly up (this is for many people around here a make or break deal) and then, oh around January, the snow storms come with a weight for which even the Alpine communites are not equipped to deal with. By the end of the season, the amount of snow lying will be abnormal (this happened last year) and the melt brings flooding. Half of Salzburg and Tyrol go under then.

I drove accross the Alps today and it is weird, really weird, to drive through green meadows where snow should be lying.

No, it was an incomplete comment. Yeah, -30C is when he begins to think of it as cold.

My great-grandad rode a bicycle from Dawson to Anchorage in January. Apparently, it was an advantage not to have tires in those conditions.

33: Yeah. That doesn't sound like fun.

In other weird-weather news, Victoria, BC got dumped on this week which is pretty rare.

Is 24 Celsius or Fahrenheit?

Growing up in Pennsylvania it always seemed to me that the Fahrenheit scale was much, much more logical than the Celsius scale. On the coldest day of the year, the high temperature is about 1 degree Fahrenheit. On the hottest day of the year, the high temperature is about 100 degrees Fahrenheit. This makes it pretty intuitive. The existence of the so-called "freezing temperature" is only relevant for concerns about snow and frost -- which hardly justifies changing its nomenclature from 32 to 0.

35: I've heard of trips like that. Never ridden in much below -25 though. You'd stay warm enough moving, but exposed skin would be a problem. Spiked wheels would help, too, I gues.

re 36

It snowed in seattle for monday night football. I thought they were playing in green bay until I notice the big seahawk on the field after halftime.

The Finns have a winter cycling culture as a matter of everyday life. It can be done.

The prairie has several periods since the last Ice Age extended as far north as Lake superior, hundreds of miles north of where it ends now. What's the soil sample history of climate change in Scotland over the last 20,000 years?

Varies also by year. Last year, we got our first snow in Munich Nov 18, and there was very little let-up until Easter.

37: doesn't matter since -40C = -40F . Or were you joking? Your argument for temperature scale is pretty regional. I find celcius much more intuitive, myself.

40: erm, the canadian prairie extends far north of Superior...

37: doesn't matter since -40C = -40F . Or were you joking?

No, I completely forgot about that.

Your argument for temperature scale is pretty regional.

Yes, that's true.

Scotland will be like northern Norway or northern Canada

Move.

Cold fucking weather--I remember changing a tire in -17F in Nebraska. That sucked.

The Short Grass prairie of the arid west, "Beyond the Hundredth Meridian," extends into Canada of course. But as Leopold observed in the forties, and was known long before that, the transition between the Tall Grass Prairie of Illinois and the Boreal forest has for most of the last glacial period been where it is now, bend in the Wisconsin River/Baraboo Hills. But it has sometimes been the southern shores of the Lake, and sometimes the North Woods have extended to Illinois, leaving behind remnants such as Volo Bog, or the Red Pines at Starved Rock.

45: gotcha. when i hear `the prarie', i think of the former.

I noticed your "colours" earlier today. Hitch your waggon, my friend.

40C is 40F, but when I was thinking of -25, I was thinking in C.

I am convinced that the most powerful advocates to stop global warming will be all of those people who bought expensive property surrounding ski resorts.

47: hitch s/b paint, no?

hitch s/b paint, no?

That too. In the late sixties, the soundtrack to "Paint your Wagon" was piped into my dad's work area, on an apparently endless loop. He did a good impression of Lee Marvin singing, but implied the effects were Gitmo-like, as we might say now.

I rode my bike in -10F, which is pretty close to 30's -25c. I rode for 10 minutes to get to a class. After the class I was too exhausted to do anything else all day. I just took a nap on campus.

52: I've done 45min to 1hr commutes as low as -25C. I didn't find it much different than in warmer weather, except for bulkier clothing.

Avoiding all exposed skin is the key, and proper protection of the feet. People would put a bootlike device over the old toe clips. I simply wore a heavier boot, cinched up the clips and flipped the pedal over. On the head, ski or at least lab goggles and a painter's mask should fill in the gaps of a balaklava. and the junction between gloves and sleeves must be tight. If you've ever dressed for snowmobiling, or ridden a motorcycle in the winter, you'll know what I'm talking about. Even skiing requires a lot of the same precautions, and the clothes are readily available.

I deliverd my paper route in high school once at
negative 35 F, with a wind chill of negative 95. I remember very clearly thinking how nice it would be to sit down for a rest in a snow bank, and then realizing how very, very dumb that would have been.

Yeah, that's what I hate about winter. If you have to spend half an hour getting ready to open the door, forget it.

Don't Eastern ski resorts generally have snow making machinery?

If you have to spend half an hour getting ready to open the door, forget it.

This is true. On the other hand, I like buying stuff, so cold weather gear always interests me. And I'd always rather be cold than hot.

rather be cold than hot is crazy talk.

57: Yes, but if it's too warm, it's still slush. I've tried to go skiing a number of times in the last couple of years and have cancelled when I realized that the temperature at Hunter or wherever was 50°.

59: Nuh-uh!

rather be cold than hot is crazy talk.

Sweating is unpleasant in non-exercising contexts. And one can always put on more layers when it's cold, but there's only so much that can be taken off when it's hot.

I will always take bitter cold over brutal hot. But I engage in crazy talk all the time.

62 gets it exactly right.

I have to go sign my son up for the 3 school ski trips tonight. MD, NY, PA. It's no great shakes, but he's learning the board, so it'll do. We'll go out to Montana at least once and maybe, if tales of snow in Victoria keep coming, we'll try Courtenay.

I don't mind cold weather. Suits my clothes.

57 -- That's one of the things that's so wrong with eastern skiing. They have to make snow whenever it's cold enough, and so oftentimes the damn things are running during the day. They don't just look like jet engines, but sound like them, and that blast of moist near-snow that hits you when you go by is worse (ie, more piercing) than any blizzard I've ever skied in.

try Tremblant, or better yet, Quebec City during Carnival, for eastern skiing.

Sharpen your edges for the ice, and don't turn on the shiny places.

Seriously, everybody needs to see a Quebecois winter before both are gone.

59 gets it exactly right. The "cold is fine, just put on more clothes!" crowd are insane. Wearing twenty layers of clothes is freaking uncomfortable, the more so when your skin is all dry and itchy to start with, and then you go inside somewhere and have to shed all your outerwear and find a place to put it or else tote it all around, and god, the cold is just so inconvenient.

Whereas hot? Fine. Lay around with a cold drink in the shade, and if you need to, hop in the pool or take a shower or something. Couldn't be better.

Maybe we shouldn't have any more discussions on this site about matters of taste.

I start complaining when the mercury hits 80, and continue until it gets back down below that again.

57: sure they do, but it's a lousy replacement for the real thing.

65: Courtney is often pretty good, even if Victoria hasn't seen any snow all year. Washington isn't Whistler, but it's pretty good.

70 -- Am I mistaken in my impression that you live in the South? I thought it got pretty warm down there.

Sweating is unpleasant in non-exercising contexts

This is so, so wrong.

I do live in the South, and I complain a lot.

surprising no one, I think hot is way better than cold. like bphd says: cold showers! iced tea! swimming! ceiling fans! cold boiled peanuts! that said I've been in India when it was 115F and it was mind-bogglingly, unsurpassably awful, way worse than very cold. it was seriously like you were tripping the whole time.

I'm the kind of loser who hates both hot and cold.

cold showers! iced tea! swimming! ceiling fans! cold boiled peanuts!

These are meant to be good things? I mean, I like iced tea, and swimming's okay, but I don't see what's so great about the rest.

Sweet! That's how people can tell us apart, redfoxtailshrub, since all us redheads look alike.

Roaring fires! Coffee! Liquor! Snuggly blankets!

I think 75 and 79 are a little misguided -- to me the question "Which is worse, too hot or too cold?" is a question about unrelieved extremes of temperature. I would rather be too hot and without relief (in the form of a cold shower or a swimming pool) than too cold and without relief (in the form of a roaring hearth and a hot toddy). I mean within reason of course, like "too hot" up to the low hundreds, and "too cold" down to like the twenties -- extremes of temperature at which my survival is not so much in question, but my comfort is.

I agree with 77. Boiled peanuts taste like peanuts but with less flavor. Cold showers are horrible. Ceiling fans are pointless.

Up until the current year I definitely liked the cold weather better than the warm weather. In the warm weather I just can't get comfortable no matter where I go or what I do, and that makes me unable to concentrate on anything or get anything accomplished in a reasonable amount of time.

This year the negative feelings associated with the dread of paying the gas bill have finally tipped the balance the other way. That will probably change if I move into a different sort of rental, though.

Whatever B. When it's cold outside you don't blog about how much it sucks that you can't sleep due to the heat and the humidity.

Well sure, assClown, if we were living in a bunch of caves in the mountain I would certainly prefer the weather to be 90 degrees than 20 degrees, since long-term exposure to 90 degrees is not deadly. But we live in a society of rules, man. Our infrastructure makes the cold weather more bearable than the hot weather for a lot of purposes.

"The low hundreds" immediately made me think "oh, say, 200 or 300 degrees." Comfy.

I adore roaring fires, hot toddies, etc., but really hate walking to work in the cold. Also I'm a big old snow scrooge.

You hoard snow? To what purpose?

so you can surprise the hell out of your nemesis in July, clown

Oh, you know, for a rainy day.

The snow in Japan has been uniformly excellent every year I've been here. Global warming? The past few winters, people in the mountain regions have been killed when the roofs of their houses collapsed on top of them due to too much snow.

Check out Niseko in Hokkaido, in January or February for the best powder you've ever seen. Really. The terrain might not be the world's gnarliest, but you won't find more consistently deep and dry powder anywhere.

And yeah, I know global warming models allow for some areas to get much colder/snowier while others warm up. All I'm sayin' is that it sure isn't hurting the snowfall out here.

CrypticNed, your vile slanders against boiled peanuts cannot stand! boiled peanuts have a unique, delicious flavor of having been under the earth, which they share with new potatoes, the kind you have only just dug up, washed, boiled and put butter on. with a slice of homemade whole wheat bread, and followed by some cold watermelon, they make a delicious complete meal. mmmm. salllllty boiled peanuts.
wanders away whistling burl ives 'eating goober peas'

80 gets at why I prefer cold to hot. I can always put on more layers or blankets, but there's only so much I can take off.

But I will drop this, so as not to upset Standpipe any further.