I am now thinking of Cameron Diaz in Charlie's Angels.
I'd be okay with this post if it didn't seem to presume that women are somehow not primates and that the urge to stare is something that only afflicts men. (Implying that we ought not to judge them too harshly for indulging that urge, the poor dears.)
1. The picture is genius.
2. Kind of true, and in the best tradition of Unfogged. I don't know that you can claim it is nature, though. No way to tell.
3. I caught myself checking out a sixty year-old from behind in Whole Foods a while back. That surprised me. OTOH, pretty attractive, by any standard.
As you know, ogged, intention doesn't matter, so whatever B thinks you said is what you said.
2: I know I shouldn't be taking the bait, but the post was written by a man about his personal experience, and the idea that it excludes the possibility of this applying to women as well doesn't seem well-supported by the text.
Good, because I was totally checking out your ass at the meetup.
6 is correct, 7 is just wrong. 8 refers to 5.
Actually, exactly this magnetic and automatic following of a woman's nice behind is what made me realize that, goddamn, I am seriously pretty freaking gay. A bunch of friends and I were at the mall and walking into a Border's, this extremely attractive woman and her excellent buttocks walked past us, and my head had practically reached a 90 degree angle in order to track her by the time I even realized what the fuck I was doing.
And then I basically died of embarassment and shame at being a creepy pervert, the end.
7 is just wrong
Got any, y'know, evidence for that?
Do all guys have a secret, stupid expression that they say to themselves when they see a hot chick? Or is it just, um, me and certain friends who have been humoring me?
And then I basically died of embarassment and shame at being a creepy pervert, the end.
This makes me so happy. Happens to the best of us, LR.
10: otoh, accident self-outing like that avoids anxiety of bringing it up with friends, I suppose.
Did I mention that I was like 15 at the time, and in a group that was largely composed of my (straight) female friends? Yarrgh.
15, you could have downplayed it by explaining to them that you were male-identified transgender. Or that they were on Celebrity Mole.
Do all guys have a secret, stupid expression that they say to themselves when they see a hot chick?
If you're married, it's: Just because you've ordered doesn't mean you can't scan the menu.
and my eyes were just little metal filings, blowing in the wind.
I strain my eyes
Only for a moment, then the moment's gone
All my dreams
Pass before my eyes, a curiosity
Fiii-lings in the wind
My eyes are mere filings in the wind.
Same old song
Just a hairy primate in an endless pool
... the rest left as an exercise for the reader.
No, 11, don't see 12. That's not the same thing Ogged was talking about.
I presume that you are talking about how Ogged used the word "guy" instead of "person" in the last sentence. Well, it still doesn't mean he was saying his experience is specific to guys.
11, see 12.
Now you're just being difficult.
I mean, not me. But other married guys might think something along those tlines.
it still doesn't mean he was saying his experience is specific to guys.
No it doesn't, which is why I accepted his saying that that wasn't his intent. But it does mean, no matter how defensive Teo wants to get, that the *implication* that he meant guys (both b/c of the word and b/c of the hairy thing, not to mention the general context in which we're operating, of hot or not threads that tend to be about chicks and more broadly a tendency of Society At Large to see men's sexual desire as more "natural" than women's) was a fair one.
I want it noted that *I* was not the person who dragged this thread off topic in this way; I took Ogged at his word.
Meh, I don't actually care that much about this, and I wouldn't say I'm particularly defensive about it. I just thought 2 wasn't a very justified reading of the post.
I took Ogged at his word.
Intentional fallacy!
I just thought 2 wasn't a very justified reading of the post.
And yet, 12 read it precisely the way I had predicted it might be read. Wanna jump all over Ned, or is it just me?
We've already had one story of sexual awakening in this thread, Teo; so how do you feel about Cryptic Ned?
You know, when I first read the thread title I thought it was going to be full of Ogged posting salacious descriptions of Pools He Has Known for the titillation of the swimmers amongst us.
Can it be about that now, please?
a secret, stupid expression
I've got about six or seven that seem to be set on Shuffle. The one that makes me chuckle is "Helloooo, nurse." No idea where it came from.
That's a great topic, Lunar, with the bonus that it will bore all but about four of us to tears. Probably the nicest pool I've swum in is in Santa Monica (there are goofy people in that picture, yes, but check out how the water comes up exactly to the edge of the pool, with the gutter built into the ground). So great. The Stanford pool is also very nice, but I always freeze my ass off there for some reason; I blame a chemical, though I don't know what it would be. The nicest looking pool I've seen a picture of is in Munich; lemme see if I can find a picture.
Have I mentioned that the National kids are at the pool the same time I coach?
Have I mentioned that they are often getting out of the pool or practicing their starts?
Have I mentioned that girl's suits are worn in the style of a Brazilian bikini?
How many Hail Mary's do I need to say?
freeze my ass off there for some reason
Maybe your fancy new swimming shirt will solve this.
Maybe your fancy new swimming shirt will solve this.
That's a good point, actually.
How old are the National kids, Will? Or is it better for all concerned if you don't tell us?
Favorite places to swim:
Ocean swims
The Lakeside Quarry in Louisville, KY http://www.lakesideswim.org/
The Hall of Fame Pool in Ft Lauderdale
Harvard's pool
I dislike Indianapolis's pool. Just cause it is too big.
The one that makes me chuckle is "Helloooo, nurse." No idea where it came from.
Animaniacs?
Ogged,
I've learned that confessions are not welcome here. But, 16 to 18. In the summer up to 22.
There's a spring-fed pool in Austin, is there not? I want to swim there.
Animaniacs?
No, earlier than that.
Oh, I forgot how much I like UT's pool in Austin.
The hall of fame pool in Ft. Lauderdale is impressive. I swore an oath never to swim long course again there, but sadly broke it at the Santa Clara pool. The new CMU pool is pretty nice for swimming, but I think the Emory one is nicer.
Swimming in the Aegean is pretty pleasant.
30: I grew up swimming at Meadowbrook, which as I have mentioned totally spoiled me. If you check out this picture you can see the weird little aquatic median strip that seperated the kiddie pool from the 50 yd longcourse part, and also demarcated which lanes of the longcourse could and could not be used for free swim. There were of course starting blocks on the median strip as well as at the opposite end of the pool, and my and my NBAC homies used to tempt the wrath of the lifeguards and our coaches/parents by doing backflips off of them. Which was really bone-headed, because the water at that end wasn't much more than about seven feet deep; maybe even five or six.
You could have been Charles Krauthammer.
Jake:
That reminds me that Pitt's pool was pretty sweet. Of course, you cant park your car near it.
NBAC's pool never did it for me. Maybe bc it was always so cold and dreary outside when we went.
Do all guys have a secret, stupid expression that they say to themselves when they see a hot chick?
Ever since I started watching The Wire I've been toying with "I'd like to throw a fuck into her". Unfortunately, I then end up thinking of the judge from The Wire, so it's kind of a secret, stupid saltpeter.
The one that makes me chuckle is "Helloooo, nurse." No idea where it came from.
Animaniacs?
I got all curious about where Animaniacs got it from. Wikipedia said it goes back to vaudeville, but I don't know that I've ever heard it outside of Animaniacs.
saltpeter
What does this mean in your sentence?
What does this mean in your sentence?
yea, Ogged gets hot when the judge appears in his mind.
Saltpeter dampens the libido, ogged, which is why Yale puts it into their cafeteria food.
41: Vaudeville?
There are some lovely pools on this campus, apparently. Also there's this ocean which people seem to like. Wouldn't know, myself.
How many Hail Mary's do I need to say?
None, assuming that you keep your salacious thoughts well hidden.
Something like what you just said is apparently an urban legend, Ben.
54: hidden from God, apostate? Not likely!
Or did you mean he'd be saying hail marys to you?
Isn't "helloooo, nurse" originally Jerry Lewis?
56, yes, ogged, I know. Everyone knows that.
Every natural-born or legitimately naturalized citizen of the US, anyway.
Man, there was some private high school pool in Baltimore that we had a swim meet at and that has to be the worst pool I've ever swam in. I'm wracking my brain to remember which one it was, but it had everything wrong. Shallow water, narrow lanes, crappy gutters, tiny locker rooms.
Oh, Pitt's pool was very sweet. We wanted to try jumping from the balcony into the pool, but our coach wouldn't let us.
Considering the number of Animaniacs references to Jerry Lewis, that would not suprise me at all.
They probably asked A. Sikkiin about it.
57: Everyone ought to be worshipping me, but fwiw I don't think god really cares what Will is thinking. The girls might, though.
56: I think that was probably the point.
Was it an all-male school of extreme preppitude? Because that totally sounds like Gilman. They also had a seperate diving pool that was for some reason downright terrifying to little me.
Pwned, innit.
Mostly a lurker, so that was my first. I've got this warm and fuzzy feeling.
65 to 61. If there is one thing I know, sadly, it is the details of snobby Baltimore prep school athletics facilities.
but it had everything wrong. Shallow water, narrow lanes, crappy gutters, tiny locker rooms.
Was the water also too warm? I remember one swim meet in high school where it was like swimming in a bath. Horrible.
Jake:
That wasnt a private high school. That was the University of Maryland's pool! That place was a DUMP. Same goes for UNC's old pool.
That would have been an impressive leap.
Who did you swim for in HS? How old are you? My best friend was Mt. Lebanon guy. Or maybe it was Bethel park.
None, assuming that you keep your salacious thoughts well hidden.
So crotch grabbing and pumping my hips would be inappropriate?
Hmm. Might be.
Although, the old CMU pool was also pretty horrific. Had to take out the diving board because of the low ceiling, lanes narrow enough that we had to set it up with 5 for practice vs. 6 for meets, which meant that the position of the line relative to the center of the lane was different for each lane, which made changing lanes in practice interesting. Also, they messed up the chemistry somehow one winter break, resulting in a pool so cloudy that you couldn't see your hand when your arm was fully extended. The color could be replicated with about 3 parts yellow kool-aid to 1 part blue; adding lots of vodka gave you "pool water punch", which became a staple of our parties for the rest of the year.
I remember 'Hellooooo, Betty,' but I have no idea where it came from.
The cathedral here has a 30s-era painting in which Mary looks, um, rather fetching. So to atone for lust, I'd have to choose a different prayer.
Frederick High School, am now 30. We were far enough out in the sticks that we got schooled at whatever the state championship meet was.
68: Yes! Ugh. Give me 60 degree water over 80 degree water any day.
Oh, Padonia was pretty awesome, too, although not so much for their lap pool, which wasn't long course and always seemed way too shallow to me.
I've started swimming again. My motivation is that my friend's 10 yr old daughter went a :45 for a 50 m long course breast. I cannot look too winded when/if she calls me out.
<insert obligatory Fredneck joke here>
80 degree water is too warm? Jeez people. My club keeps the pool way too warm. I've gotten used to 81 as being cool. So sad.
I better sign up for water aerobics.
Damn, that Munich pool is sweet. I win the lottery, I'm totally building myself something like that. Or moving to Munich.
The pool at the University of RI that I used growing up was absolutely horrible. It's worse now, from what I understand.
78-79 is perfect for a pool. If you like it lower than that, you're fat.
Just splashing around, warm water is pleasant. If you are swimming for real in water in the 80s, though, surely your times are suffering for it!
Christ, am I not-fit. Not that I was ever anything but a terrible swimmer to start with.
Isn't "helloooo, nurse" originally Jerry Lewis?
No, you're thinking of "Oh, fwybah bwlah hgawhfh nice lady".
72: Ugh. I remember a meet in a pretty boonies-ish part of PA that was held at a pool I suspect was basically sourced from the local river, and it had a similar color/consistency.
I actually agree. 77-79 is the ideal temp.
A polar bear ogged ain't.
Merely a white bear sympathizer.
60 might be overstating things for effect. But if you're working, 65 is nice. There's nothing worse than being sweaty in a pool.
And Frederick is now a booming metropolis! They have three malls, a Wal-Mart, and everything. Take that Fredneck joke back!
65 is nice
Holy crapoly, dude. 65?! They lost heat at my local pool last year and it was down to the upper 60s and I thought my head was going to implode from the cold. I lasted about twenty minutes.
87: not obviously, if he's trying to boil her alive in the municipal pool.
65???!?!?! Are you out of your mind? Have you not been in a pool recently?
89: The Baltimoron recants, hon.
90: Dude, what are you, anorexic?
pwned by Ogged. Maybe 75. But 65 is wetsuit time. (Rashguard in Ogged's case.)
So crotch grabbing and pumping my hips would be inappropriate?
Exactly. As long as you're not doing those things, or wolf-whistling, you're totally in the clear.
anorexic?
Not if I can make it to Whole Foods before traffic gets too bad. Perhaps Will can convince you of the madness of 65 degree pool water by the time I get home.
Never been in it, but this looks like a neat "pool."
65 was clearly a joke. You do not knowingly swim in 65 degree water in a pool.
I have more hair than Ogged. But I remember only two times that the pool water was so cold as to really bug me, and once was in an outdoor unheated pool in Frederick in May, and the other was at the hall of fame pool in Ft. Lauderdale when the heater broke for several days.
I also have more padding than Ogged.
You have to understand, Will, I was an adolescent girl who did stupid adolescent macho-boneheaded things like double-backflipping into five foot deep water. Showing off by swimming in cold water/oceans = finally, an area to show off in where my gender was a distinct advantage over the boys!!!
Also, I've always been weird and loved the cold and been unusually sensitive to heat.
The Hall of Fame Pool has never been 65 degrees.
Where you there for a meet or did you train there?
19: For this married guy, it's nudging my wife and saying "2 o'clock" or whatever the bearing is to the pert bottom in question. It's only polite to share, after all.
When my wife spots the hottie first, on the other hand, she generally snaps her head directly towards the target and asks "what's that?" in a particular cheery tone.
Lunar:
Don't get me wrong. I am the same way with heat. I can get in the Bay when it is fricking cold.
But, I don't want my pool to be 65 on a regular basis. Not even 70.
The UVa pool was regularly 75 or 76 when I was there. That was freaking cold as ice and I was working my ass off.
Also, I've always been weird and loved the cold and been unusually sensitive to heat.
Just as I said, you're male-identified.
I think the scorecard of people I have heard complain that a room was too cold stands at about Women 80, Men 0.
65 degree water will eventually cause hypothermia, but y'all are wusses.
Why, I used to swim miles off the coast of Maine as a lad! 65? We would've killed for 65.
No, 65 degree water is pretty damn cold. Not enough to knock the wind out of you, but not all that comfortable long-term.
106: Just as I said, you're male-identified.
I know you probably don't mean that in either of the ways I'm used to hearing it, but no, I'm really not.
The Hall of Fame Pool has never been 65 degrees.
Where you there for a meet or did you train there?
Winter training trip over New Year's for my college team. It was cold enough that half the team got out, and most of who was left went to two swim caps. I did put one on, and I won't like and say that it was fun, but it was better than being too hot.
106: interesting, I have friends who completely invert that pattern. He is constantly turning up the heat in the winter.
"Male-identified" is simply the accepted Mineshaft method of dismissing women who demonstrate the untruth of sexist stereotypes, LR, don't worry about it.
Man. I'm being a big sexist jerk by implication and generalization. I feel bad.
the untruth of sexist stereotypes
I stand by my statement.
50: saltpeter
All I know of it is as gunpowder ingredient (along with... sulfur and charcoal?). Which brings to mind Blood Meridian:
We hauled forth our members and at it we went and the judge on his knees kneadin the mass with his naked arms and the piss was splashin about and he was cryin out to us to piss, man, piss for your very souls for cant you see the redskins yonder, and laughin the while and workin up this great mass in a foul black dough, a devil's batter by the stink of it and him not a bloody dark pastryman himself.
women are somehow not primates and that the urge to stare is something that only afflicts men.
Oh, I'm sure it's present for women, but it afflicts men worse. And differently. Probably every man in this thread knows I'm right. Not worth opening the endless debate with all the necessary provisos and qualifications, but the difference is there.
You have to understand, Will, I was an adolescent girl who did stupid adolescent macho-boneheaded things like double-backflipping into five foot deep water. Showing off by swimming in cold water/oceans = finally, an area to show off in where my gender was a distinct advantage over the boys!!!
You're probably aware of it, but I recommend Swimming to Antarctica. I put off reading it because, after reading her New Yorker article, I wondered if the book would feel repetitive, but I found it surprisingly moving.
Oh, I'm sure it's present for women, but it afflicts men worse. And differently. Probably every man in this thread knows I'm right. Not worth opening the endless debate with all the necessary provisos and qualifications, but the difference is there
How on earth would we know this? It's kind of hard to get at the subjective experience of others of your own gender, let alone the opposite one.
117: No, I wasn't, actually! Thank you.
How on earth would we know this?
True enough, but either we get to make big generalizations about broad classes of human beings, or we don't. Other minds are always inaccessible. The generalization that women are the same as men in urge/drive/whatever for skeevy sexualized staring requires just as much mindreading as any assertion of differences does.
120: So maybe we could just skip the "everybody knows that" sort of generalizations completely?
119 -- It's an amazing book.
She accomplishes incredible athletic feats which require unbelievable courage and stamina but that is only part of what struck me about the book. I was most moved by her dedication -- how much time she spends preparing for swims, and the effort of gathering her support teams and raising money in a sport with so little public recognition. It seemed so ascetic.
Lots of video of Lynne Cox (who really is amazing) here.
121: well, it's a handy shorthand way to appeal to the mass of unorganized experiential evidence supporting a generalization. My experience leads me to believe there are a lot of on-average differences between men and women in this department, I'd guess other peoples' experiences lead them in that direction too.
124: What is the relevant experience? I don't think "my male friends say different stuff than my female friends" is particularly strong evidence.
By the way, this flip into a pool video needs watching.
Wow, Ogged, that's incredible. I'd heard of her, but hadn't really seen much. Goddamn.
We did this kind of thing as kids, too.
What is the relevant experience?
Let me throw this out there:
1. The threads regarding Catherine's hotness, and that of her competitors, attracted 800-plus posts from males and females, probably more than half of them on-topic.
2: The threads regarding Kriston's hotness attracted 80-plus posts - and I have no idea how many were on topic because I never got around to reading them.
3. This result was completely predictable.
4. These data suggest that perhaps men and women regard feminine beauty differently than masculine beauty.
5. This sort of result is visible in all kinds of places to anyone who is paying attention.
Now this may, of course, be the result of the patriarchy - I'm not making a case for innateness here.
But the anonymous 115 reflects my experience: Oh, I'm sure it's present for women, but it afflicts men worse. And differently.
From your own experience, do you disagree, DaveL? And whether or not you do, do you really think it's inappropriate for us to try to generalize from our experience?
pert young lifeguard-bot preparing to launch.
I have also done this! Although in those cases, the fence was chainlink, which posed some unique problems.
130: speaking of which, the Clinton Yates, Patrick Healy, and Mark Leibovich factions have each amassed around three thousand votes.
But even worse, the rumored JessicaHolzerBot made its appearance this afternoon! Catherine is not the only candidate with a 5-digit number of votes.
From your own experience, do you disagree, DaveL? And whether or not you do, do you really think it's inappropriate for us to try to generalize from our experience?
You're missing the point. I'm not saying that men and women are the same, I'm saying that having another long stupid argument about "men are x and women are not-x" is, um, stupid. What interesting thing are we accomplishing by discussing whether everybody knows that men care more about a woman's attractiveness than women care about a man's attractiveness?
Shorter 134: LESS COMPARITIVE DONGOLOGY, MORE BACKFLIPS.
134: whatever it is, it must be damned interesting to have generated as much typing as it has.
At some point you must choose to believe either that there are differences between the sexes or that there are no differences between the sexes. Through studious exploration I have personally uncovered at least one potential difference. No doubt future research will yield further results.
Ogged version of backflip.
Looked good to me!
You are a crazy person if you're doing backflips into pools.
Thanks for the heads up, Ned. I'll keep an eye on that Holzer character. We have bots at the ready.
LESS COMPARITIVE DONGOLOGY, MORE BACKFLIPS.
Everyone on this blog should take this to heart.
I don't ever remember being disturbed by the force of the urge, the compulsion to look. I can keep from staring stupidly, which is an important social skill, just as not reacting to many other things is, but I never had an idea of myself or my will that would make finding myself staring at all unsettling.
Am I not getting the point? The strength of instantaneous, unexpected sexual feelings has always been a kind of comfort to me, a connection. I've never felt threatened by them.
What interesting thing are we accomplishing by discussing whether everybody knows that men care more about a woman's attractiveness than women care about a man's attractiveness?
Seems like an interesting question to me - but that's not the question that I was asking. Read me again and attempt to represent my point honestly - you can even use quotes ! - and I bet we could have an interesting conversation.
But gosh, I must say, taken on your own terms, you are certainly right: Discussing whether such a conversation would be interesting would be pretty boring.
Why do you hate America, Ogged?
Bet you never tried to pop a wheelie either. You fail.
I can totally pop a wheelie! Come on! (On a bike, anyway.)
dear god.
I hate to be the one bringing this newsflash to some of you, but WOMEN CHECK PEOPLE OUT. Women check out men, women check out women, and women talk about it. They even have code-words for it. Several. Or else me and my entire circle of friends are not women, and would somebody please let us know.
That said, I think men in the US are much less fun to look at then women because they don't make any effort at all - they don't even want to look like they made any effort at all.
they don't even want to look like they made any effort at all
149: no, no, nothing like that. I just arrange myself so there's no contact between the ground and my front wheel. In fact, I'm doing it right now!
147: If I told you, they wouldn't work so well, would they?
cheers.
I hate to be the one bringing this newsflash to some of you, but WOMEN CHECK PEOPLE OUT.
Can you point to who indicated that this might not be true? I can't figure out who you are SHOUTING at.
Okay, Sifu, you've stumped me, I give up.
More risky behaviors I have engaged as an adolescent.
146: Or else me and my entire circle of friends are not women, and would somebody please let us know.
The International Bureau of Patriarchal Normativity regrets to inform you that you are probably some sort of clandestine hermaphrodites. Sorry about that.
148: Seems as if my brother and I, so different in many ways , have this in common: we've always been fuckwits. Also my son. Not my dad though; he was careless and sloppy, with little sense of how he looked.
153: hey, Mr. Grumpy, pop a wheelie!
154: well, I'll put it this way: is your front wheel touching the ground right now? No? Congratulations!
156: 148 is canonical. The ultimate victory of Midwestern over Persian.
is your front wheel touching the ground right now?
Surely this question is not truth-apt?
originally, the nameless person in 115 who might be Marcus.
though I am happy to aim it in your direction too. You just cannot make generalizations like that because you don't know what is going on in women's heads.
I really detest being spoken for like that, by men.
The hottness web contest list is a bad example because iirc just about all the women who commented agreed (& it was my impression too, though unspoken) that at least the first 8 men on it (pretty much until Carl Hulse) were terrible, terrible Arrogant People who we would personally like to kick in the shins. Not inspiring.
and now, as unsporting as it is, I have to disappear from the internets, so apologies, bye.
More risky behaviors I have engaged as an adolescent.
You, madam, are insane.
Let me have my petty sophistries, dammit. Would it appease you if I made "invisible wheelie!" motions with my hands?
Read me again and attempt to represent my point honestly - you can even use quotes ! - and I bet we could have an interesting conversation.
You're new, right? We've had that very conversation too many times to mention, and it has never been interesting.
For what it's worth, half the reason that the Catherine thread was so much longer than the Kriston thread is that at first, that was where the botting discussion was all taking place.
You (non-specific you) dong-obsessed morons.
157: ... somehow, I feel like I need to be stoned to fully appreciate that answer.
Lunar:
We did that as youths too.
We also spent the night on a train tresle "safe" spot. utterly stupid.
Wheelies are too important to allow your petty sophistries! Although the cops in Monterey were far too facist last weekend; we only saw one wheelie around Cannery Row, and that was some dude on a bicycle. No burnouts, and no fights, either.
160: You, madam, are insane.
It gets better: we did it in parking lots, so we could whirl around!
166: I'll even make "vrooom! vrooom!" noises.
Whenever things like this come up, I send these videos to a childhood friend and note what pussies we were.
130:
The threads regarding Catherine's hotness, and that of her competitors, attracted 800-plus posts from males and females, probably more than half of them on-topic.
Quantification cannot be wrong.
169: Jenga can be pretty freaky towards the end of the game.
Damn it, John, I wanted the last word.
oh, the swimmers in the crowd probably did this:
When we were at a meet and our hotels had balconies, we could climb to the balcony above us (if it was another swimmer's room). The hotel at the Cinn Pepsi Marlins meet was perfect for that.
165: We also spent the night on a train tresle "safe" spot. utterly stupid.
I know of people who did this, although it was at an age when we had largely segregated out by gender and I wasn't included. It seems like it must have been awesome, though, although that may be my youthful madness for anything involving trains speaking.
Or else me and my entire circle of friends are not women, and would somebody please let us know.
You and your pussy friends are not women.
You're welcome.
Lunar:
It was stupid. Fun, scary, but stupid.
My friend kept climbing on top of the concrete ledge (1 foot wide maybe?). The river and lots of rocks waited below. I was not happy.
177: My friend kept climbing on top of the concrete ledge (1 foot wide maybe?). The river and lots of rocks waited below. I was not happy.
speaking of: waterfall diving woo!
... you know, now I'm really curious as to when developed my crippling fear of heights, because I was well into teenagerhood before I stopped doing this kind of shit, and yet there's no particularly traumatic experience I can remember to set it off. Heck, my parents tell a story of a time we were crossing the Bay Bridge going to Ocean City through a really insane, heavy storm, and my little cousin and I kept freaking out by opening the windows in the rear seat and leaning out into it.
I wish I knew when I developed my fear of heights. The triumph of the greatest moment of my high school career (gluing a cardboard Mickey Mouse to the school's Back-to-the-Future style architectural clock), I wouldn't rappel over the edge, and a friend had to go. Truly, I was filled with shame.
I always told myself it was the inherent unreliability of my friends who were on belay duty, but really, I'm just scared of heights.
Quantification cannot be wrong.
I hope I was clear that I didn't consider that little anecdote a definitive indication of anything in particular. But I did consider it representative of other experiences of mine. And I was/am curious about other peoples' actual experiences. Are your experiences different in this? Do you think men and women react/think essentially identically about beauty, either masculine or feminine?
(And bless you for actually quoting me.)
hey, Mr. Grumpy, pop a wheelie!
I think I'm separated by about 30 years from my last wheelie.
I must say, though, that I am proud to be christened "Mr. Grumpy" on a blog where Emerson is a regular participant. Would it be presumptuous to adopt "Mr. Grumpy" as my regular pseudonym?
I had the opposite experience, of losing my fear of heights in adolescence. My mother was very afraid, and before I was twelve or so, I couldn't climb very far off the ground at all. Humiliating.
Then, to my exhilaration and relief, I began to be able to do it, and started climbing, extending and hanging-off at just about the time many people found they couldn't.
I nominate Mr. Grumpy and Frowner to chair the Social Committee.
Rocky, I love you, but I am never letting you anywhere near my son unless you promise not to encourage him to follow your macho example.
I submit that the reason some of the guys think women don't check men out is that women don't check *them* out.
I'm sorry, guys. Maybe if you took a little bit better care of yourselves, y'know?
I don't understand people who didn't do stupid stuff like that as a kid. How'd you fill your time? Homework? Crafts?
Well, sure, me too, but it didn't entirely replace climbing trees and setting fireworks off indoors.
When I wasn't reading, I was swimming at the neighborhood pool. Where we weren't allowed to do backflips, obviously.
Unlike *some* of you, I didn't have my *own* pool.
I submit that the reason some of the guys think women don't check men out is that women don't check *them* out.
Enh. I know a fair number of guys who get checked out frequently but have no idea it's going on. I think women are just more subtle about the checking-out.
184: Ya' mean my 15-year old, ratty shorts aren't cutting it?
Jake, don't be here defending Marcus and that lot, or I'll have to ban you.
I am with Sifu: didn't everyone do stupid stuff like that? I was hardly wild and we did crazy stuff all the time.
Naked chicken fighting, swimming in the river at night, sending the night on the boat. Good times.
allowed to do backflips
The point was that you were not allowed to do it.
B, I'll be good, I promise! Plus PK sounds like a very responsble and safety conscious young'un; you're raising a pretty remarkable kid there. Also, you should check your mail.
I never had my own pool, though. Hell, until high school we lived in a pretty janky rowhouse, so technically not even a yard.
188: well, we couldn't very well do backflips into the pool on the yacht, could we? And obviously the gables of The Breakers are rather too high to make a leap into the olympic size pool advisable.
Enh. I know a fair number of guys who get checked out frequently but have no idea it's going on. I think women are just more subtle about the checking-out.
Or the men just think the women are casting their eyes downward to show how submissive and demur they are.
Hey, I was in fact 115. I didn't mean to leave my name off.
Everybody checks everybody out, there's no question about that. But this thread wasn't about checking people out, it was about staring fetishistically and lustfully at someone's ass.
We've had that very conversation too many times to mention, and it has never been interesting.
That's true, just thinking about another go-round on the men/women bit makes me tired. Especially since, free of the investment people make in digging into sides, everybody would probably agree on some sensible medium anyway. However great the between-sex variation is, it's less than the within-sex variation.
193: The point was that you were not allowed to do it.
Yeah. There was quite a lot of potential-head-injury chicken and oneupsmanship going on; you got more close the closer you were to the shallow-end/kiddie pool zone. And of course, always off the concrete; starter blocks were acceptable but only as a means to get in more potential rotations. The board proper was right out.
If I get banned for that, the ignominy will kill me.
And really, it's critical to do the stupid shit when you are young and still immortal. Or at least have fast-healing bones. I regret not doing more when I had the chance.
Yes, I'll always regret not running headlong into that brick wall more.
The point was that you were not allowed to do it.
Well, at our neighborhood pool, if I'd done that shit I'd not have been allowed back. Y'all obviously had homeowners associations that simply didn't care about children.
194: Actually PK, so far, is way safety-conscious. Hell, half the time *I'm* encouraging him to do shit (like jump off the diving board at swim camp) and he's saying "no fucking way."
(He did do it, but one of the cc students had to go out on the board with him.)
Now is when I will make my obligatory comment about how Sleater-Kinney's song "The Swimmer" is an ode to the "Swimming to Antarctica" woman adapted from the New Yorker article about her
You're welcome.
I mostly just climbed on roofs, ran around half naked in graveyards, did drugs, and rode around in cars that my friends were driving at truly insane speeds. And read books. I was a tame one.
Bitch
You have to much respect for authority. Most of the time is was all bark, no bite. They arent going to kick you out. They say, Bad, bad, bad. Don't do it again!
Jake is correct. These are things to be done while your bones bend easier.
Although the only bone I've definitively broken is my skull. Which has to count for something.
201: homeowner's associations?!? Who's all fancy now!
Actually pretty much all of my "try to do a backflip into water" experiences came at a quarry, although I did do the odd leap off a shed.
I mostly just climbed on roofs, ran around half naked in graveyards, did drugs, and rode around in cars that my friends were driving at truly insane speeds. And read books. I was a tame one.
I never dared to do any of those things (except read books). I was afraid it would derail my as-then-nonexistent ambitions.
I have never broken a bone, which serves admirably to demonstrate my tameness. I liked to spend an embarrassing amount of my childhood time chattering away with adults.
I submit that the reason some of the guys think women don't check men out is that women don't check *them* out.
I'll say it again: Is there someone on this thread who made an assertion resembling "women don't check men out" ? Who are you debating here? As I requested previously: Please quote.
Absent some quote, this looks like yet another unprovoked assault on defenseless straw men and straw women.
I nominate Mr. Grumpy and Frowner to chair the Social Committee.
Frowner is one of my absolute favorites. I really do feel compelled to change my pseudonum here. I think apostropher and Sifu have me pegged.
We've had that very conversation too many times to mention, and it has never been interesting.
Fair enough, but I wouldn't blame it on the subject matter, which seems intrinsically fascinating. In fact, I read the original post as a direct invitation to discuss this - and so did B and others.
Although the only bone I've definitively broken is my skull. Which has to count for something.
Me too. I jumped off a hay truck while it was moving. Apparently, it is important not to do that when the truck is moving more than 15 MPH. fractured my skull.
This is confusing, though. I was pretty tame, in the scheme of things, but when you're a kid crazy moments like "say, I think I'll try to do a flip off this riser!" or "I bet I could hit that snow between those trees just like in Dukes of Hazzard!" just seem to happen, don't they?
210: Absent some quote, this looks like yet another unprovoked assault on defenseless straw men and straw women.
Yeah, how about the unprovoked obnoxious comments about people's gender identity upthread?
Cry more, please.
Did anybody else here make napalm or Clorox bombs when they were little?
I was pretty tame, in the scheme of things, but when you're a kid crazy moments like "say, I think I'll try to do a flip off this riser!" or "I bet I could hit that snow between those trees just like in Dukes of Hazzard!" just seem to happen, don't they?
Yeah...I sort of never actually convinced myself that things like that had a chance of success.
Aim high, kids!
I did use a rope to swing into a swimmin' hole a few times, in which leeches were known to dwell. If it was crocodiles or hippos, though, I wouldn't have dared.
I agree Sifu.
Michael, we never made bombs.
We tried to jump things, climb things, and generally do stupid stuff. We didnt do planned out stupid stuff.
You have to much respect for authority.
Alas, true.
homeowner's associations?!? Who's all fancy now!
Dude, it was the 70s.
and so did B and others.
Oh no way, don't drag me into this shit. I made one attempt to hassle Ogged, he replied mildly, there was no fun to be had and I let it go. Y'all whipped this one up all on your own.
Didn't everyone make Drano bombs? And pack the nose cones of model rockets full of gunpowder? Or their GI Joe tanks full of firecrackers?
221: When I was a kid I heard rumors that some kids had gunpowder or firecrackers, but never saw such substances myself. At least until we reached the age when those explosions would stop being fun.
A. "That Louise Wong's got a balcony you could do Shakespeare from."
B. Swimming in the Limmat River in Zurich is worth it. So is Tribune Bay (in BC).
At least until we reached the age when those explosions would stop being fun.
90?
I set the carpet in my room on fire by mistake once. It melted horribly. But no actual napalm, no.
At least until we reached the age when those explosions would stop being fun.
Which is?
I actually wasn't much of a pyro as a kid, apart from illegal firecrackers and rockets, and really regret it.
Hmm, 14? I assume you mean very small explosions.
I actually don't know what gunpowder looks like. I think it's black.
Sorry Lunar Rockette. I shouldn't have mentioned you personally.
Oh, hey, Jake! You don't happen to be an emacs user, do you?
We avoided gunpowder. My best friend's dad was a huge gun guy with a huge regard for gun safety and an anarchistic view of regulating anything else. Everything goes, but stay away from guns,gunpowder or bullets. Oh yes, and fire. BC a fire accident would have screwed up his hunting.
Oh, as for napalm, no. Tried to make thermite, but powdering the magnesium is hard, as is lighting it. Stump remover + sugar is a good one, as was potassium permanganate from the bio lab plus water and aluminum foil. Flamethrowers with spray paint or carb cleaner also work pretty well, and are a favorite of boy scout camp.
Potassium permanganate isn't just pretty and purple, it actually helps you blow things up?
Never anything to do in this town, live here my whole life
Probably learn to die in this town, live here my whole life.
Nothing to do, sit around at home
Sit around at home, stare at the walls
Stare at each other and wait till we die
Stare at each other and wait till we die
Probably come to die in this town, live here my whole life
There's Kerosene around, something to do
There's Kerosene around, she's something to do
There's Kerosene around, she's something to do
There's Kerosene around, we'll find something to do
Kerosene around, she's something to do
Kerosene around, set me on fire.
Escape-Meta-Control-Alt-Shift? Of course.
216: not those. Dry ice bombs were pretty common, and we used to douse tennis balls and then play some high-temperature soccer/catch, but really: pretty tame.
Certainly not crazy like those desert people.
My friend Deth Vegetable got to be on Dateline NBC after a file he wrote about recreational explosives manufacture was used as cause to prosecute some dumb kid in Connecticut, and then later misused in the process of some idiot Quebeçois kid blowing off a couple of his fingers. This was in the early days of internet hysteria, so you can imagine. Our house scared the crap out of Deborah Roberts while she was there.
Explosives are definitely something kids should be learning about. I look forward to many warm bonding moments over big booms when I have kids.
My only rowdy friends were both Magic The Gathering losers and Republicans. The rowdiness mainly consisted of trampoline wrestling.
Potassium permanganate isn't just pretty and purple, it actually helps you blow things up?
It's a pretty impressive oxidiser. So yeah. Dissolve in water, add aluminum foil.
Quebeçois Québécois
no cedilla unless the c sounds like an s
No kidding? I don't speak your crazy moon language. Arguably, I don't speak my own crazy moon language, either.
No apologies necessary, Ned; I assumed you were in good faith, this is just a very touchy subject for me. (Anyone else who keeps bringing this crap up can go backflip into an inch of water, though.)
234: Know of any particularly nifty python-related things I should be aware of, beyond the obvious?
Yeah, how about the unprovoked obnoxious comments about people's gender identity upthread?
Cry more, please.
Dammit. Here we are yet again. I seem to be being accused of something, and I have absolutely no idea what. Can you quote some unprovoked obnoxious comment that I have made about gender identity? Seriously. Quotes. Quotes. Quotes. Quotes. I have a real problem being held responsible for saying things I didn't say.
A friend and I broke into our former school once, after it had been abandoned. We found a set of keys and golf clubs in the boiler room, and we went around smashing stuff--thermostats, globes, typewriters, System 80's. He took a shit on the library floor, and I dumped a bag of cement all over my fourth-grade classroom. Good times.
And pack the nose cones of model rockets full of gunpowder?
Firecrackers, here. It's surprisingly hard to get the nose cone to stay on when the motor blows its parachute charge, though.
Er, yes, python-mode. And C-c < / C-c > become very useful.
Nerdily, we used to regularly crash the Corvus in the Apple II lab at my elementary school. A first act of malicious hacking, and all it took was about two lines of BASIC and ten minutes. Were that it were still so easy.. oh, hey, it is. Good deal.
Oh no way, don't drag me into this shit..
This shit was initiated by you in 2 (except to the extend that ogged brought it up in his original post). If you don't want to talk about something, one approach would be to not bring it up.
I think what happened was that as soon as the shit started to get stirred, Ogged and others realized that a discussion of backflips, explosions, and broken bones would be more entertaining than yet another session of comparative dongology. See comment 140. So even though the original post can easily be seen as a glaring invitation to rehearse the battle of the sexes yet again, those of us who took the invitation were insufficiently attentive to subtext.
Also, B and Emerson get a free pass for all shit-stirring because they are B and Emerson. Gradually, one learns the mores of this strange imaginary place.
244, 245: Thanks. Anything worth sticking in the .emacs?
Also, B and Emerson get a free pass for all shit-stirring because they are B and Emerson.
If they would just stick to stirring each other's, the rest of us could get on with the serious work here. That being reminiscences of our unexciting childhoods.
At least until we reached the age when those explosions would stop being fun.
During the riotous end-of-year celebration where I went to school, chem majors used to nick a log of sodium from the chem building and drop it off a bridge into our local big river. Ker-plash, BOOOM!
250: Also, comparitive dongology would have been more welcome if, through no real fault of Ned's own, 18 and 106 were not gigantic bullshit. The pool, she has been pissed in, so to speak. As far as I am concerned, I certainly can't contribute anything productive to this thread without either a) devolving into all caps or b) offering up a lot of painful personal history of both myself and my loved ones on the altar of being "reasonable" and "consciousness raising", and frankly, fuck that all with a stick, I'm talking about backflips and editor modes.
Oh, sodium is super fun. A friend gave me a bunch after he decided he wasn't allowed to have it anymore.
"Backflip" certainly should be an editor mode, much as it should be a cat trick and a state of mind.
MEN GOT THIS COUNTRY INTO THE MESS IT'S IN
248 and 249, did you not read my 8?
But if you insist, I'll agree that you boys lack agency and the ability to control what comes out of your mouths, sure. You can't help yourselves, any more than you can help checking out women's asses. Poor dears.
Before comparative dongology becomes Officially Banned, let me try to slip in one last on-topic comment -
An excellent training program for attaining elite levels of gaze control is to 1) be a dude, 2) be into dudes, 3) be expected to to get naked with dudes periodically throughout puberty and adolescence without being observed collecting any dongological data (you have to start training young if you really want to be competitive!) and 4) believe that some unspecified but certainly bad combination of humiliation and asskicking would be the result of being identified as a born dongological talent.
fMRI studies of such individuals reveal that the Frontal Eye Fields have nearly taken over the brain, competing for cortical real estate only with robustly expanding representations across the Left Inferior Furtive Masturbatory gyrus.
As an alumnus of this program, while I can empathize with the original post, I've experienced the opposite problem: I actually had to learn to relax and enjoy those "Hey, lookin' don't hurt nothin'" moments. Which I notice has become easier as I get older/dirtier.
I've suspected for a while that Opinionated Grandma's got a diving board you can do backflips from.
250: Gradually, one learns the mores of this strange imaginary place.
Your judgment on this is obviously correct, and I will take the appropriate instruction.
Many people had the intellectual capacity to enjoy the Algonquin Roundtable, but relatively few were intellectually equipped to participate in it. I may need to return to lurking for a bit.
I actually had to learn to relax and enjoy those "Hey, lookin' don't hurt nothin'" moments. Which I notice has become easier as I get older/dirtier.
Right there with you.
255: It's amazing how explosive it is. The first time I saw the reaction demonstrated, it was a tiny bit, maybe an eighth the size of a pencil eraser, and it put paid to a large beaker of water with an impressive bang. These logs were maybe a couple of pounds, IIRC.
That kid who almost built a breeder reactor in his back yard makes all crazy teen stories otiose. That said, backflips are probably more fun than nuclear reactors.
diving board
my new favorite ambiguously dirty euphemism.
theory: the theory that women don't care as much about how men look is championed by unattractive looking men.
Text, though it will pain you, I note that B Weiner-pwned you in 184.
I wasn't a kid any more, just young and stupid, when a friend and I made art of a frozen waterfall with food coloring, using a .38 to correct mistakes.
259:Left Inferior Furtive Masturbatory gyrus.
That's the one with the inhibitory connections from the Oh Shit Mom nuclei, right?
258: geez, B, could you be any more heavy handed?Actually, wait, don't answer that.
261: no, I think you have to get banned like ten times before that's required.
theory: the theory that women don't care as much about how men look is championed by unattractive looking men.
In response to this, 146, and 184, it seems that since there are more women who go to the effort of making themselves look attractive, then men would be more likely than women, in a given day, to perform an act of ogling, simply because there are more ogling targets who stand out from the crowd.
264: that story is 100% the best ever. Some of the hacker stories I've heard are almost equally terrifying, though.
though it will pain you
or rather, because it pains me. and it does.
But if you insist, I'll agree that you boys lack agency and the ability to control what comes out of your mouths, sure. You can't help yourselves, any more than women can help checking out your asses. Poor dears.
since there are more women who go to the effort of making themselves look attractive
You make it sound so . . . voluntary. What planet are you living on?
I don't think 264 used "otiose" correct.
That's one of my favorite words to come across in a written piece of invective, along with "catastrophic", "inept", "odious" and "lassitude".
I'm not sure if I agree that men ogle more. It may be that we're just not very subtle. But we might ogle more, and if so, 271 would be a good justification. Ogle on.
I don't think 264 used "otiose" correct.
To quote our great president, "Who cares what you think?" Anyway, I believe it to be correct.
the theory that women don't care as much about how men look is championed by unattractive looking men.
On the contrary, unattractive people are the most keenly aware of how the opposite sex judges looks.
Ogling, otiose, obfuscated by ovaries? Obviated by onanism? Obnoxious optical occasions: ongoing.
On the veldt, men who weren't very good looking needed a story to tell themselves to demonstrate that their wives weren't sleeping with other men. And so it was decided that women care more about resources than looks.
...and 281 wins the dong portion of the thread.
Anything worth sticking in the .emacs?
Hell if I know... posting that link exhausted my knowledge of emacs vis-a-vis Python. I'm a vim boy myself.
theory: the theory that women don't care as much about how men look is championed by unattractive looking men.
Dammit, I really will shut up after this comment, but you are discussing an area of my personal expertise.
Us unnattractive men do not champion this theory. Nor is it, as B in 184 would have it, a matter of wishful thinking. We experience this fact. Women, in general, cut unnattractive men a lot of slack.
284: vim! Vigor! Wit! Lightweight interface! One needs nothing more.
It's not 1985 anymore, people. Computers have more than eight megabytes of memory and enough cpu speed to process event loops.
I did not do any backflips, but as a teenager I did swim in an unfrozen mountain lake that had snow melting directly into it.
Bah. 285 is pwned by 280. Good night.
Goddamit. I'm going to stop talking about computers on unfogged. Talking about subverting my own self-interest.
It's not 1985 anymore, people. Computers have more than eight megabytes of memory and enough cpu speed to process event loops
It is thoughts like this that cause people to have to upgrade their computer every two years to run their operating system.
Moore's Law is keeping you down, man! Stand up to the jackboots of forced progress! Yesterday for tomorrow! Yesterday forever!
It's not 1985 anymore, people. Computers have more than eight megabytes of memory and enough cpu speed to process event loops.
Yes, but I *already* have an operating system on my computer. Why do I want to add another just to edit text?
291: It is thoughts like this that cause people to have to upgrade their computer every two years to run their operating system.
Well, that, and porno videogames porno.
We're not talking about Gizmodo, Lunar.
Why do I want to add another just to edit text?
And read mail, and execute code, and manage version control, and browse the web, and irc. Besides, vim runs away if you lose the terminal, and for god knows what reason was dumpingg core when I tried to edit commit messages.
It is thoughts like this that cause people to have to upgrade their computer every two years to run their operating system.
Is there any way to buy a new computer that is A) not a Mac, and B) not pre-loaded with Windows Vista? This may finally cause me to make the leap to Macs.
I think Dell sells computers loaded with XP or Linux. I'm also pretty sure that IBM does. But you should buy a Mac anyway.
Is there any way to buy a new computer that is A) not a Mac, and B) not pre-loaded with Windows Vista? This may finally cause me to make the leap to Macs.
Funny, my uncle called me a few hours ago with his new computer/Vista problems. My answer: do you still have your XP disks? And yeah, I've resolved that my next laptop will be a mac, and I'll just load Windows in Parallels if I really need it.
Women, in general, cut unnattractive men a lot of slack.
Possibly. Or possibly it's just a difference in how men and women perceive male attractiveness.
And read mail, and execute code, and manage version control, and browse the web, and irc.
I think you're proving my point.
Besides, vim runs away if you lose the terminal
Behold the magic of "screen". I don't run anything that's not automatically power-detached.
and for god knows what reason was dumpingg core when I tried to edit commit messages.
Maybe it saw what you were trying to commit...
298: Here, too. But honestly, if you're not comfortable making a box from scratch (which is way easier than it sounds), you'll probably be better off with a Mac. Or just finding somewhere that still ships boxes with XP. Alienware definitely does.
I think Emacs wins just for being the gateway drug to LISP or Scheme for a lot of people.
Text, it'll make you feel better to know that your 282 pwned what was going to be my next comment. If only I hadn't had to eat dinner!
Also: emacsclient kicks the crap out of anything vim has by a mile.
I've resolved that my next laptop will be a mac
Sowly, slowly, Ogged is beginning to realize the errors of his ways.
On the veldt, people who said things that other people had already said found slightly new ways of saying them a third time, so that when the first person came back from dinner . . .
No, no. That wasn't the veldt. They came up with that after the invention of the staircase.
I think Emacs wins just for being the gateway drug to LISP or Scheme for a lot of people.
You and I have different ideas of winning.
Also: emacsclient kicks the crap out of anything vim has by a mile.
Text editors shouldn't need a client server model.
On the veldt, when a person needed to get away from the computer, there was no place to go. And thus, the staircase.
Also: emacsclient kicks the crap out of anything vim has by a mile.
I'm not seeing the attraction. To the extent I want to edit multiple files in the same process, vim already pretty much does that... but I don't find myself wanting to do that very often. (Well, actually, I've never found myself wanting to do that.)
Maybe it saw what you were trying to commit.
I think that time I was actually fixing something that was seriously broken. Of course, I then changed the shared not-quite-root account's .profile to include export EDITOR=emacs and waited to see how long it was before someone noticed.
And now some of us have regressed, and live in ranch houses without stairs. Thus we witness the decline of civilization.
The people who lived in ranch houses on the veldt spent all their time on the computer, and so did not notice the sabertoothgiantslothlions. And so, ranch houses were contraindicated.
Things evened out in the Great Staircase Cooling Period.
I've suspected for a while that Opinionated Grandma's got a diving board you can do backflips from.
Another unprovoked obnoxious comment questioning someone's gender identity?
But I thought that living in ranch houses was the ne plus ultra of traditional gender role division! Now I'm just confused.
If only I had a staircase to go to, where I might be able to think.
Maybe there's one you can pull down from the ceiling to get into the attic?
We don't have an attic. There's a step from the porch to the walkway, I wonder if that would count. Maybe if I kept stepping on it, like an aerobics class or something.
If I had a pool, do you think I'd spend so much time online? Hardly.
This is why they invented the inflatable lounge chair with a cup holder and laptop platform. Where do you think I post from all day?
Fuck. You're just trying to make it harder for me to find an affordable house once we start looking, aren't you?
Though come to think of it, the odds that PK would let me get away with that are zero.
I feel your pain on the affordable houses. It's even worse because rents are so much cheaper, especially with roommates, so anything I can remotely afford is not nearly as nice as what I can rent.
But you can always be delightfully retro and install an above-ground pool.
I just saw Armsmasher leave Blackcat.
His girlfriend is much better looking than him.
Sorry smasher
Regards,
Long time lurker short time admirer of your girlfriend
234: Know of any particularly nifty python-related things I should be aware of, beyond the obvious?
I'm not Jake, of course, but Pymacs is pretty nifty.
you can always be delightfully retro and install an above-ground pool.
Don't think I'm not seriously considering this.
His girlfriend is much better looking than him.
This is so true.
Also, the kid who "almost" built a breeder reactor is totally pwnd by the scavhunt team that really did build a nuclear reactor.
Also, the kid who "almost" built a breeder reactor is totally pwnd by the scavhunt team that really did build a nuclear reactor.
And the kid in that John Lithgow movie
In order to catch up
1) Is Bitch PhD a PhD in Philosophy?
2) Is Ben w-lfs-n getting a PhD in Philosophy?
3) Is Ogged a J.D.? If so, did he recieve his PhD from U of C?
Sorry, but I'm on vacation and decided to ask some questions that would provide answers that weren't obvious to me
Being a lurker is a tough gig
333.1 Dear god, no.
2. Yes
3. Dear god, no.
328: See, I knew my ghetto version of Ask the Mineshaft would come in handy! Much love, B-dub.
327: Long time lurker short time admirer of your girlfriend
The Unfogged commenter who may or may not exist wishes me to inform you that he finds the above fuckin' hilarious.
Clever analysis of "aker rul"'s name has revealed to me his (for, as we shall see, he is a he) identity or perhaps character type. Each component of the "nick" must be decoded. In the first case it's simply rotational: "aker" becomes "rake". The second is reversed: "rul" becomes "lur". And then the whole thing is reversed, yielding "lur rake": a dashing Persian type.
Ogged! We've found out who's stealing your wimmins!
This semi-existing person is right about that one, for sure.
Follow up
1) What did Bitch PhD get a PhD in?
2) Ogged is just a businessman? How boring
3) Can someone explain why 14th between T and U sucks so much? I went out there the last three nights and it was dreadful
(outside of seeing Armsmasher and his girlfriend of course; they looked very interesting, but there was no scheduled meetup so I figured a bad time to make introductions)
337: I bet he's got a real personal style, too, the sneaky lothario.
339:2: At the risk of violating the sanctity of off-blog communication, no, not really.
339.1: That is officially unknown. I am an expert in bra and shoe studies, though.
339.2: Still incorrect.
Aker,
I'm going to tell you something that I was once told by a teacher of mine, something not unlike what you might have heard Laurence Fishburne tell Keanu Reeves in the first Matrix movie.
What distinguishes a true teacher a source of answers? The question is sharper in the case of a subject such as high school mathematics, in which often the textbooks have answers to the problems posed at the back. If you just wanted to know the answers, you could just look there! What does the teacher provide in addition?
Surely the real answer is that the teacher provides many things. But one of the chief services a teacher can perform on a student's behalf is the guidance of that student's inquiry into productive channels. Letting the student know, not when s/h has given the right answers, but when s/h has posed the right questions—and then watching as the student asks more questions.
So I cannot tell you what bitchphd's degree is in, not because I do not know (though I don't), but because it would do you a disservice. Nor can I tell you how ogged earns his daily bread, for the same reason. I can only confirm that you're asking good questions. The answers you'll have to find for yourself.
Where we weren't allowed to do backflips, obviously
sigh ...
three old men sitting around in a retirement home in Florida.
"God it's been a good life", says the first. "The thing that stays in my memory is the war, when I fought with Tito's partisans. We killed dozens of Nazis".
"Ahhh yeah", says the second. "I was in the French Resistance. We blew up a train with a hundred Nazi soldiers on it!"
"You are soooo lucky", says the third. "In Holland that was not allowed".
In unrelated news, I went to the opera the other night - I actually went in my suit because I had to go straight from work. There appear to be a lot more birds looking at me these days as I am now embracing my inner 70s dude and have my natural curly hair rather than a banker's haircut.
w-lfs-n, of course, went into his Ph.D. program in philosophy directly after his Master's in Being A Little Bitch.
In Soviet Russia, birds watch you!
An M.B.A.L.B. with concentrations in spoon bending and trenchcoasts, apparently.
I went to the opera the other night - I actually went in my suit because I had to go straight from work. There appear to be a lot more birds looking at me these days as I am now embracing my inner 70s dude and have my natural curly hair rather than a banker's haircut.
I'm sure the suit doesn't hurt, but this is exactly right.
I had the feeling that Ogged had become a lawyer over the last few years though the listed biography didn't acknowledge it. I apologize for digging
Ben, I'm sorry for asking silly questions.
I'm sure you can forgive a lack of creativity when it came to the name. It's unique as far as I can tell, and that seems to be the most important criteria
w-lfs-n is not only a little bitch, he is a liar. He does too know what my degree is in. He has consulted my expertise, as it is difficult to find non-judgmental salespeople in PA.
Now that he's moved to SF I anticipate being far less troubled by his constant queries, thank god.
You might also consider "A Lur Cur" if you're going to do this whole "Racer X is secretly speed's older brother!" thing with ogged.
re: being checked out, etc.
I'm still fairly sure I occasionally* get checked out by women, and I'm a fat(ish) balding(ish) bloke. Anyone who thinks women don't do it a lot is on crack.
* although much less than say, 10 years ago. Of course I could be delusional, or they could just be wrinkling their nose at the insane body odour of which I am unaware, or something.
aker rul, Ogged is in fact a 19yo lifeguard who channels the spirit of Cyrus the Great when the inspiration descends upon him. He will conquer Babylon after the summer when it's cooler and he can get out of the pool. It's better you don't know what B's PhD is in, or the DHS will start taking an interest in you.
ttaM, I'm sure you get checked out all the time. I get sweet young things smiling and making extended eye contact several times a week, and I'm an elderly, obese cripple. In fact I'm reaching the age where I'm beginning to wish they'd stop it.
There's a spring-fed pool in Austin, is there not? I want to swim there.
Yep. Barton Springs Pool. It's lovely, and great for laps because it's something like several hundred yards long. It is very ass-freezing though, about 68 degrees year-round. And it's been closed a lot lately due to all the runoff from all the rain.
Did someone mention affordable houses? Estimated payment $32 / month. (Perhaps the $7000 house I listed earlier was too spendy for some of you.)
Does it come with a pool? I can't tell from the picture.
Oddly enough I had to stop myself from staring at a guy when I was getting out of the swimming pool on Monday (I am a very very bad swimmer and every so often take lessons over the course of which I improve infinitesmally). I didn't even get a proper look at him, just registered "whoah" and then looked away instantly so that I wouldn't be caught. Mainly because I would feel humiliated to be caught checking out someone a lot hotter than I am, like I have no entitlement to even think of such people that way.
No, but it has indoor plumbing and oil heat. No more chopping wood! No more trips to the outhouse at 30 below with a 20 mile wind! This is a modern house.
One permanent holdover from growing up in Berkeley is my inability to remember that staring at people is wrong.
One permanent holdover from growing up in Berkeley is my inability to remember that staring at people is wrong.
The staring is ok. But you need to stop licking your lips while you stare.
No, but it has indoor plumbing and oil heat. No more chopping wood!
You say that like it's a good thing. How is one supposed to have everyday spiritual adventures in such a house?
. . . like I have no entitlement to even think of such people that way.
Now that's an attitude that I wouldn't expect from an emir.
Emacsclient in this thread looked liked "emasculent," a class of specific substances I had never heard of, allthough easily hypothesized.
But you need to stop licking your lips while you stare.
I tend not to stare at people I desire---too self-conscious! Instead, I stare at the guy with the weird bulgy muscles and stretchmarks, or the old lady with the interesting varicose veins, or the girl with the awesome jeans I covet....
Let's start an early morning betting pool on what today's Unfogged posts will cover. I'd wager there are excellent chances for both a Tour de France and an Alberto Gonzalez post.
I think we're long overdue for another hot-or-not thread.
Tour de France: not hot
Alberto Gonzalez: not hot
or the girl with the awesome jeans I covet
Surely coveting awesome jeans was not a value instilled in you in Berkeley?
What did Bitch PhD get a PhD in?
Architecture.
PhDs in architecture: hot
BitchPhD: not hot
hot or not threads: not hot
Surely coveting awesome jeans was not a value instilled in you in Berkeley?
In Berkeley, clothes fall into the To Be paradigm; it wasn't until later that I learned to To Have paradigm. So staring at a person's jeans back then was to cast about for a new and better identity: typical hippie quest narrative.
I once lusted after a hippie who was wearing only a scanty little paradigm shift.
Now that's an attitude that I wouldn't expect from an emir.
I blame it on being raised by humble peasant foster parents.
374: While your evil double lived it up in the emir's palace, lusting at will, no doubt. So sad.
I just saw Armsmasher leave Blackcat.
His girlfriend is much better looking than him.
Well, this just tells you. 30 times as attractive as any other man in his profession, and yet not as attractive as his own girlfriend.
I'm still fairly sure I occasionally* get checked out by women, and I'm a fat(ish) balding(ish) bloke. Anyone who thinks women don't do it a lot is on crack.
Much as in this situation, I assume that I have probably been checked out at least once in my life, but have never been aware of it happening.
And I'm not hideously deformed or anything. Am I? Help!
DAMMIT can someone PLEASE set it so it doesn't close all tags at the end of every paragraph? Just doing it at the end of every post should be protection enough.
You know who women really check out? Three-year olds (dogs, horses, toddlers). My grandnephew can take over a roomful of women in the snap of a finger.
The women tend not to be hott 25-year-olds, of course, since sex education has taught them all to view babies as preventable diseases.
354: Finally, I get the recognition I deserve!
(Yes, I know what it's actually referring to. But it feels like so few other people do, that when someone does know, I enjoy it.)
Teo, I think you're being unfair to people who presume "Gonzales" has a Z on the end. If you search for "Gonzale" at baseball-reference.com, you get 5 Gonzaleses, the last of whom retired in 1997, and 28 Gonzalezes, 8 of whom are currently active. I would have bet a lot of money that the Z spelling is the standard one, until reading your post anyway.
What distinguishes a true teacher a source of answers?
My kid and I have really been enjoying Kung Fu on DVD.
David Carradine was apparently stoned much of the time.
In my current job I deal with metric shitloads of documents from people with the last name of Gonzale*, and I'm pretty sure I see a lot more with a "z" on the end than with an "s". Often within the same family different members with the same paternal or maternal last name will spell it differently from each other, and I even sometimes see people who spell Gonzale* one way on one form and another way on another form, mailed in the same envelope.
That said, thanks for reminding me that dear Alberto uses the "Gonzales" version.
and I even sometimes see people who spell Gonzale* one way on one form and another way on another form, mailed in the same envelope.
To be clearer, I mean they spell their own name two different ways.
It all just goes to show that transliteration from the original Mexican is a tricky business, what with the pinyin system preferring an "s" for the sound at the end of Alberto's last name, and Wade-Giles favoring a "z".
We know a Lat/vian named Gonzalez (2 Zs). I'm not sure whether this is a case of a long-ago Spanish emigrant to the Baltic states, or convergent linguistic evolution (that seems unlikelier, doesn't it?). I mention this just because it's great, not because it sheds light on anything.
387: Watch for Emerson to connect it with the Tatars.
Latvians, Mexicans, same thing.
Say rfts, I've been meaning to ask for awhile if you're still making that NYT no-knead bread very often, and if so, whether you have any more modifications/improvements to it that you'd like to share.
This is probably a good place to note that for a while, people in college called me Lopez.
Alas, sorry, I haven't been -- this time of year, especially, I tend to skip out on baking, and when I have made bread since then, I've gone back to my old method. It's more work (though honestly not all that much work), but I do just like it better.
390: Some kind of bureacratic screw-up whereby you were given the wrong name tag?
LB used to wear a big condom over her left eye and a gigantic pacifier around her neck, actually.
Nah, I was bitching about the Midwestern blandness of the Mexican food at a burrito place people I knew went to, and it was noted that I was not ethnically entitled to so bitch. When later in the conversation someone I'd just met asked my last name, I said it was Lopez, and it stuck.
Times have changed, Lopez. College City is now considered to have the most authentic and vibrant Mexican regional food by many experts. Often in storefronts and wonderfully cheap and good. College neighborhood, otoh, still has nothing very authentic besides Harold's.
I only knew the place as 'Steak Burrito' -- it may have had a real name. Someplace south of Hyde Park.
Did you think outside the bun?
I've been playing around with it a lot lately and have gotten to where I mix it in a bowl, let it sit out at room temp for a few hours (say 3 to 6), then fridge it for anywhere from 12 to 24 hours or so, depending on what else is going on in my life, then take it back out to come back to around room temp (2 to 5 hours approx.), then dump it in the pre-heated dutch oven and bake.
That way I never even have to touch the dough with my hands or dirty up any surface or container other than the bowl, a wooden spoon, and a rubber spatula. And it comes out good consistently, both in shape and taste. It doesn't seem to suffer at all from not being allowed to rise into shape outside the bowl.
I've generally been making it in a ratio of about 3 parts bread flour, 2 parts whole wheat, and 1 part rye. The long cold rise does noticably improve the flavor and texture. I also have been making the dough even wetter than in the recipe, and never adding any extra flour after the initial mixing, since I don't have to handle the dough except in the bowl with a rubber spatula.
Because it's so easy and muss free, I've been making bread every other day or so lately. However, I do actually miss the kneading and shaping aspects of bread-making, and I think that it's possible to produce a superior product that way, though it's not as foolproof as the no-knead recipe. I may try to switch to a schedule of making "real bread" on the weekend and doing the no-knead stuff during the week.
I have to return to the original topic for just a moment.
Did someone say something? I'm sorry, I was trying to have a good time.
Mitch is buzzkill lite -- about 55%.
404: How can you try to have a good time with all that's going on in the world? Haven't you heard the latest about the Tour de France? And Alberto Gonzales??
Harold's.
Southside food is nasty. Although, in fairness, Northside food isn't so great either now that Fluky's is gone. Tacos al lengua?
Dude. Here in the heart if NC, we do Mexican food right.
Apo, if you've never been, well, go.
PS -- Anyone who's ever been there will be utterly SHOCKED that they have a website.
WHY WON'T IT STOP RAINING I'M GOING INSANE.
It's my window, I can't stand the rain. (Me I'm supa-fly, supa-dupa-fly.)
Haven't you heard the latest about the Tour de France? And Alberto Gonzales??
I think Gonzales has been blood doping. There's no way a guy could lie so strenuously for such an extended period without medical assistance.
I'm too hot to handle, too cold to hold. I'm called The GhostBusters and I'm in control. Had a throwin' party for a bunch of children. All the while, slime was under the buildin'.
This is probably a good place to note that for a while, people in college called me Lopez.
I'm now beginning to suspect that is was La Raza cronyism that got you this Unfogged gig.
412: Red blood cells from young and eager DoJ underlings, or straight for the erythropoietin?
The man is an ass.
Mathematicians get that way sometime. Maybe we can get her started on the Tower of Hanoi problem. That will keep her occupied for awhile. Or the Bridges of Konigsberg,
No elementary graph theory will keep this mathemonster down.
Heebie, I've heard that the circle has recently been proved squarable. Go to it.
I wouldn't trust Time Cube without another source, John.
I heard there's a new seven-layer Time Cube, wrapped in a crispy flour tortilla, that's good to go.
I'll square your circle, yeah! And you can take that all the way to the bank.
Nevertheless, it appears that the chief claim of Ray's ideas relates to the "simultaneous" existence of four days within a single rotation of Earth and the subsequent inference that the planet itself is not a physical "entity", as its hemispheres actually rotate in opposite directions and cancel out, as antipodes.
Doesn't everyone know that? I thought this guy was original and different.
424: you left out the word "deposit" in between "that" and "all".
424: all the way to the bank
In Konigsberg, of course, so long as he crosses each of the 7 bridges once.
428: And remember, smaller bridges can be stacked on top of larger bridges, but larger bridges cannot be stacked on top of smaller bridges.
And if the terrain is orange, you have to lay your block sideways because if you stand it on end, the orange brick will crumble from the weight.
Heebie may have the best ass of any mathematician in history.
The people talking up Leibniz's ass are completely full of it.
Maybe it's the sleep deprivation talking, but I think 414 may be the most excellent comment in the history of the Internets.
Oh no, wait, which 414 are you referring to?
I get very confused when people don't follow the house style.
If my rhyme was a drug, I'd sell it by the gram.
This thread's gone pretty off-topic, right? And this seems right up Unfogged's alley, doesn't it?
432: It's the powerful magnetic effect of heebie's bottom on your "little metal filings", IYKWIM.
435: House style: henceforth all good comments will be credited to Brock. Got it. (Sorry, heebie.)
But...I thought we were friends, DS. Sometimes I feel like I don't even know you anymore, man.
I think that that Gans lady got to him.
Goddammit, it cut off my fake "Nino Brown" tags. I renounce Unfogged and all its works.
House style is house style, heebie. You know the rules.
And due to Unfogged low rambling nature, house style is ranch. Cool ranch.
It matches our salad dressing.
450: No, house dressing it Russian.
452 s/b "No, house dressing, it Russian."
Yum.
Oh, sure. Here you say "yum", but at my blog you're all "that's revolting".
Oh. Is Cool Ranch our Doritos flavor? I knew Unfogged had an official Doritos flavor, but I keep thinking Nacho Cheese for some reason. I think because LB is Hispanic.
Is Cool Ranch our Doritos flavor?
No house? Dressing it! (Russian.)
The official snack food of Unfogged is, of course, Flaming Hot Cheetos.
(Man, I so want a sound clip of that kid saying "when I eat them I go craaaaaaaazy" as a ringtone)
456: That back pocket of yours is so amazing, apo.
Hey, M/tch, and other baking types - I occasionally make pizza, and it turns out ok, except that the base looks fine but is kinda tasteless. Any thoughts on what might be wrong?
There are lots of hot mathematicians, John. It's your relentless humanities/Tatar bias that makes you think otherwise.
461: I'm amazed that you presume you're entitled to tasty pizza crust, emir.
But anyways, what's in your pizza dough, and on what do you bake it?
The official condiment of Unfogged is Tatar Sauce. And the official potato side dish is Tatar Tots.
I occasionally make pizza, and it turns out ok, except that the base looks fine but is kinda tasteless.
The longer the rise, the better. Most pizzerias put their dough in the fridge the night before. This actually makes pizza an even better weeknight option.
Are you using olive oil in the dough? A pizza stone/clay tiles? Semolina on the baking surface for both release and textural variety?
You can always mix fresh herbs into the dough. And/or brush on garlic oil prior to adding sauce.
465 is full of good suggestions. Also, upping the salt in the dough can make a huge difference. Just do it a little at a time until you find the level you like.
The longer the rise, the better.
Specifically, a long, slow, cold rise.
Also, for pizza crust, you should do like that reverse-engineering piiza nerd from NY and hack your oven so it can break 800 degrees.
Didn't Lopez know about Pilsen?
BitchPhD: not hot
Did you think I wouldn't see this, Ttam?
M/tch, can you give some quantities/proportions for how you're making the bread?
Good call on the salt, M/tch.
But don't salt it so much that you can't sprinkle a little big-crystal salt on the edge for extra-tastiness.
Dammit M/tch! Tell me how to make bread!
M/tch & JRoth:
Dough - strong white flour, yeast, water, salt, olive oil. I'll try a long rise the next time, though my fridge is very short on space. I probably will up the salt too as my taste is for salty things. I use a pizza stone but not semolina (I'd have to hunt for it in the shops). Fresh herbs sound like a good idea. Garlic, otoh, makes me queasy.
Thanks for all the suggestions.
So, SO true about the salt. Higher levels of salt also retard the action of the yeast, allowing you to have a longer slower rise/ferment.
Useful thoughts on making pizza.
A recipe I like, despite its lack of long rising time, found because of the abovelinked Grub Report piece. I generally make a batch, divide into quarters, and freeze the lot. Using a rolling pin, as he suggests, is sacrilege, but sometimes I do it anyway. Preheating the stone for a long time helps. Using only 1/4 cup of sauce for each 10" pizza is good too.
Instead of semolina, I often form my pizza on a piece of baking parchment and then slide the whole deal, dough and parchment together, directly onto the baking tiles. Again, sacrilegious, but tidy, and the crust is still excellent.
Didn't Lopez know about Pilsen?
Only people blinded by the snobbery of an "authenticity" cult believe that ethnic types only produce good food within their homogeneous enclaves. There are good taquerias in most neighborhoods. (Except for downtown, dammit!)
470: Yeah, I can't believe Ttam thought he would get away with that!
471: The recipe is three cups of flour. So usually I'll do 1 & 1/2 cups white or bread flour, 1 cup whole wheat flour, and 1/2 cup rye floor.
For a lighter version, I'll do 2 cups white, 2/3 cup wheat, 1/3 cup rye.
I put in a little less than 1 tablespoon of salt, and I use the La Baleine coarse crystal sea salt.
As for water, if I remember correctly the recipe calls for something like 1 & 5/8 cup water, and I always add at least 1 & 3/4. But basically I just keep adding water till it looks about right to me, i.e. very wet but it still holds together some.
As should be obvious, I'm pretty slapdash with this recipe. I don't weigh out the ingredients, but I use a consistent method of measuring the volume of the flours, and then add water till the consistency is "correct" so I get a pretty steady ratio of everything every time.
Any other questions?
Sure. There were good taquerias all around Wicker Park, near the blue line stop and if you go down to Division (taquerias and more!). But there isn't a whole hell of a lot going on in Hyde Park, and Pilsen's right over there, so instead of complaining she shoulda gotten up off her fannie and done something about it.
You put any yeast in there, M/tch?
481: Oh, um, yeah. I usually put about half what the recipe calls for. I think the recipe calls for 1/4 teaspoon. I use less because with such a long rising time you don't need that much and I think having the rise progress more slowly improves the end product.
