Didn't you guys break up or something?
Yeah, who is bpl again? Was it that recent girlfriend?
It sounds like she's trying to get all the benefit of Ogged's wit and leisure companionship without having to put out.
That would have been a safer challenge before the Internet.
Also, forget that 900-comment thread on Obama's race speech. That is ancient fucking history. Today's foreign policy speech is entirely awesome. It is full of sanity. It nails the 3am Commander In Chief Experience Threshold BS to the wall.
The "l" in "bpl" actually stands for "librarian", Minivet, so it wouldn't have been that much more difficult.
Bass-playing librarian. Aw yeah.
It probably mentions, America, though, HL, so it will only end in disappointment.
Why does the Unfoggedtariat hate America so?
The way to win a debate with John McCain is not to talk, and act, and vote like him on national security, because then we all lose.
Cold!
I thought it was ba/ss-playing lungfish. What the hell?
(And has ogged been telling his mom it stands for ba/ss-playing Lur?)
5: I was going to dispute that but I find myself turned on.
Maybe if you found an equal number of shark attacks in various bays you'd convince her that the ocean is no worse.
Or you could do what I did in Costa Rica, which is to start kayaking by the bay's shore, continue out into the ocean, get ensorcelled by the empty openness of it all and lose track of the time you've been paddling, then eventually turn around and panic at how far out you've inadvertently gone. Followed by dodging some rather inconveniently located rock formations on the way back in.
It was kind of cool, though. It turns out that a calm ocean is eerily quiet.
11: Next thing you know, they're going to Tahoe.
Does this mean bpl's internet skills are greater than you have been assuming?
Does this mean bpl's internet skills are greater than you have been assuming?
Actually, I wound up running the search myself.
This whole thread exists just to set up 16, doesn't it?
i've completely forgotten why we refer to o-dog as a "lur". Wikipedia does not enlighten.
right, i read the article. Lurs are an ethnic subgroup of Persians. But why call Ogg a Lur?
i mean, i always had the sense that there is something insulting about it.
Obama's speech today shows once again A) how smart he is, and B) how he is still contstrained by the messed-up set of political assumptions we're operating under.
Take this quote:
The war in Iraq has emboldened Iran, which poses the greatest challenge to American interests in the Middle East in a generation, continuing its nuclear program and threatening our ally, Israel. Instead of the new Middle East we were promised, Hamas runs Gaza, Hizbollah flags fly from the rooftops in Sadr City, and Iran is handing out money left and right in southern Lebanon.
Why does Iran have to be a threat to us? Why is Hamas our enemy? etc. etc.
I think/hope Obama is smart enough to get this, but even he still has to do his ritual obeisance to the hawk orthodoxies.
Good to see him get off the civil rights track though and back to the Commander-In-Chief stuff. He won't win if his major identity is the Black Candidate.
OK, back to attacks on kayaks and girls who gave Ogged the axe.
But why call Ogg a Lur?
Because he's Mexican?
Obama's speech took place in home town, a few miles from my house. FTCC is where I took chemistry in high school. Sadly, it was closed off to the public.
Isn't a lur also an ancient Scandinavian ritual horn?
Here's a memoir by a daughter of anthropologists who ends up thinking that she's a Lur.
Obama's even worse on on foreign policy. Iraq war longer than WWII? Bloody Yankee.
You're going kayaking! Cool!
An observation occasioned by the thought that if the economy's tanking (unclear, nobody knows, see 900-comment thread), my income will take a dive, and how then will I ever go kayaking; and by the librarian comment upthread:
I sell books; these being an ostensible leisure commodity, you'd expect buying to be down. Who's going to thinking about, oh, perspectives on the family in ancient Greece and Rome, or census results in 19th century France, at a time like this?
It's noticeable that what continues to be in quite hot demand are books on criminal law and procedure, on educational reform, on corporate finance, and of course medicine, psychological and otherwise. Mm. There are books I would much rather purvey to you, and indeed some persist in the study of folklore and mythology, architecture, or the collecting of ceramic fish for decoration of the bathroom, just for a laugh.
30: Dang, I thought poked my fingers through the sock.
23: You misspelled "illegal".
where the third item is about an Iranian guy honeymooning with his wife
where the third item is about an Iranian guy honeymooning with his wife [damn HTML]
So, when's the happy day, then?
29 was a fantastic post. Especially the last paragraph. I loved the "mm", an involuntary murmer of sensual appreciation for the beauty of books.
Of course, I love to read.
34: That would be lovely for ogged, wouldn't it? Not the shark attack or possible murdering part.
This picture was taken in a bay. Just sayin'.
God, that's awesome. Note that the shark didn't attack. My backup position has been that most of the stories don't end with the kayaker being killed, but that hasn't been a winning argument. How awesome would it be to come back with bite marks in your kayak? Totally awesome.
Or a cute, non lethal, non-amputating scar in your leg?
There should be enough lawyers in this forum in case you decide to sue the shark.
Swampcracker has evidently never heard of professional courtesy.
35: Providing books to people is a window into their very souls. One doesn't judge. (One does notice. It's a funny business, especially when you have the opportunity to push.)
I didn't think so many couples who broke up still hang out afterwards. I am just not that mature.
So are you guys really broken up? If so, how does a couple make "just friends" work?
I look at my boyfriend with anticipatory devastating heartbreak, and think that if we broke up, the only way I could stay nominally "just friends" was if we broke up only because I had to move away for a job. It would take moving across the fucking country, because then we couldn't hang out anyway, so sure, I'll be "friends."
It's like some people don't read every word.
Ogged, whose perspicuity is exceeded only by his schnoz, was mistaken in asserting that he and the bpl are no more.
pwned because I wanted to find the name of the guy from Lungfish.
Ha, that's from the Planet Earth series. I might have already shown her that. I have another friend who's afraid to surf because of sharks. Is this really a common fear? It seems so strange to me.
Back on the veldt, surfers and kayakers.... oh, never mind.
Is this really a common fear?
Apparently it's not an uncommon occurrence. I was trying to find the video from the Mythbusters episode in which they were doing some shark-related myth and went to South Africa. Jamie is standing at the back of the boat, talking about how many sharks there are in the area, and a great white jumps clear out of the water behind him. He seemed a little nonplussed. They might have engineered the shot somehow, but it looked as if it just happened that way.
It might be more than you have in mind, but this trip off Baja is spectacular. Minimal shark threat, IIRC. Alternately, the San Juans are a sea kayaker's paradise—how does bpl feel about orcas?
Funny you should ask. During a youtube search for sharks we found one of an orca killing and eating a shark. That's good, right?
Both trips seem like tons of fun!
How much life insurance do you carry on her?
"Trip" is a bit overblown, this is something we'll do on a weekend day. It's almost like the outrageous real estate prices are worth it...
53: My kids were five and seven when Jaws came out in 1975. Splashing around in the ocean was just a little nervous-making for all of us.
Sorry Ogged! That is the only (crucial) post I missed! Forgive me! Don't ban me!
Fuck, I have to get back to writing my paper proposals. My job should be browsing the internet. This is how I miss stuff.
Regardless. Both ideas seem like fun.
We were lame last summer and didnt use our kayaks.
My job should be browsing the internet. This is how I miss stuff.
It's like some people don't read every word.
I have been surfing in the SF bay area for a while now and I have never seen a shark.
There are a lot of dolphins out in the last few years because of the global warming or something. It is pretty common for people to panic then tell everyone they saw a shark.
I sail in the open ocean and haven't seen a shark. But Tomales Bay sounds beautiful, and I've never been. Let us know how it goes.
I have been surfing in the SF bay area for a while now and I have never seen a dolphin.
There are a lot of sharks out in the last few years because of the global warming or something. It is pretty common for people to fail to panic because they think they saw a dolphin.
I sail in the open ocean and haven't seen a shark.
Oh, they are there, Belle. Just circling and waiting for you. Just below the surface. Just out of sight.
Waiting for someone to fall off that boat.
Crap. And I can't swim! Not that swimming saves you from sharks anyway. What are you supposed to do again? Bop them on the nose, or is that just in cartoons?
I don't know if you can put in at the northern end of Tamales Bay, but you might be able to swing a little of both Bay and ocean. Depending on the wind, you might well end up preferring the Bay -- it's certainly pretty enough country.
(I don't know the north end as well; most of my time in TB was in the south, digging clams.)
66: I can't swim either. I hate always having to listen to people talk about how they like scuba diving, kayaking, surfing, the beach, blah blah blah. STFU already. There should be support groups for non-swimmers.
43: Providing books to people is a window into their very souls.
Parsimon, reading this comment made me think that you would enjoy the Aldous Huxley short story "The Bookshop" (originally collected in Limbo, but available in Collected Short Stories as well). It is extremely short, does involve a bookshop, and is my current choice for best very short work of fiction evah.
Available in the same volumes is the splendidly named "Eupompus Gave Splendour to Art by Numbers", which should have some resonance with readers of Unfogged.
During a youtube search for sharks we found one of an orca killing and eating a shark. That's good, right?
I was going to find a link to some gruesome death by orca, but guess what? There is apparently no record of a wild orca ever killing a human. Orcas are your friends.
69: and how about George Orwell's "Keep the Aspidistra Flying". The main character works in a bookshop. A lot of the novel is about Orwell's ambivalent relationship with middle class English identity, but there's lots of great stuff on the book selling biz.
68: There should be support groups for non-swimmers.
I think you've found it, or at least a support group for people who hate hearing about swimming. That would be everyone at Unfogged minus ogged, bpl, will, myself a few others.
There should be support groups for non-swimmers.
I understand that the American Red Cross sponsors them.
Available in the same volumes is the splendidly named "Eupompus Gave Splendour to Art by Numbers", which should have some resonance with readers of Unfogged.
That really is a splendid name.
Penelope Fitzgerald wrote a book called The Bookshop, no? I think I may have read and then lost it.
There should be support groups for non-swimmers
i mean sure i like happy people, but
i recall a flight when a couple sat next to me and kept making out i don't know how many times during the 4 hrs flight, it was disturbing
but i'm not about that, may be you can try mountains, river kayaking if you must, coz no sharks there like for sure
Wait a minute. If you and bpl broke up because bpl thought it was odd that you still maintained friendships with your exes, and yet you are currently maintaining a friendship with bpl who is now one of your exes, shouldn't this suggest to bpl that she revisit the issue of the oddness of ogged maintaining friendships with his exes? Or did I miss something? (which I probably did...).
Among other things, you've missed comments 45 and 46 in this very thread, O Nameless.
69: "Eupompus Gave Splendour to Art by Numbers"
Fantastic. I love this.
The Huxley and Orwell noted, thanks. Bear in mind, though, that the exposure to the soul &c. is involuntary; the books remain sexy.
Is this really a common fear?
If you'd had a proper American childhood, Ogged, you too would have seen Jaws and been scarred for life, as Biohazard suggests.
80: Oh. Well, that should teach me not to skip an entire chapter in this novel I've been reading.
An irrational fear of sharks is perfectly rational, I think. It's a giant prehistoric fish! and it wants to eat you.
If you're going to that part of the Bay Area, you should watch The Birds to take your mind off sharks. When I was a kid I thought it would be interesting to kayak on the bay. I was wrong. Kayaking off of the San Juan Islands was also dull.
Birds are scary too. They'll peck your eyes out. And they're also prehistoric.
I've kayaked in San Francisco Bay. I liked it. Neither sharks chewed on me nor birds pecked at me.
Oceans are full of shit that shouldn't be evolved enough to kill you and it does anyway. Fuck oceans.
Oceans are full of shit that shouldn't be evolved enough to kill you and it does anyway.
And to add insult to injury, that shit doesn't even care about your hard-won authenticity and who you really are. It just wants to eat you.
It just wants to eat you.
Talk about authenticity.
I think you guys have sort of hit on what I like about oceans.
You've got anarchy in your very soul, B.
Eupompus Gave Splendour to Art by Numbers
The title is from a cryptic observation in Jonson's Discoveries. I was curious if Huxley could have possibly been punning off of "paint by numbers" as well, but apparently that concept originated after World War II (story was written in 1920). But I did learn that Michael O'Donoghue of NatLamp and Saturday Night Live fame was a paint-by-number collector. I'd write more on these interesting subjects but suddenly I am pecked to death by seagulls run over by a truck.
92: Actually just a deep sense of humility. But don't tell anyone.
I'm still self banned, mostly, but I had to drop in to say that kayaking kicks all kinds of ass and I miss mine. That is all.
Oh, and what B said. Oceans are excellent. Anywhere that doesn't have one could be improved by being near one.
White people like living near the ocean.
95: kicks all kinds of ass and I miss mine
We earnestly miss your ass too.
Everyone likes living near an ocean, B.
meh. I just miss it when I don't, but that's probably because I grew up a stones throw from ocean. And real mountains. It's a hard combination to find.
kobe told me go back on autoban
White people like kitsch. No, really. True story.
If you're going out that way, make sure you do it late in the week (Thursday or later) and stop off at the Tomales Bakery (in, surprisingly enough, Tomales) for breakfast.
99: Yep, ocean + real mountains = heaven.
100: kobe told me go back on autoban
Careful, kobe also say autobahn is highway to hell.
Oh criminy. Sharks don't kill kayakers. Hypothermia kills kayakers. Also, the Maui thing was just plain old insurance fraud, according to a friend who had some involvement in the case. Last I heard, the wife was believed to be alive and well, probably in Iran.
I will say from personal experience that a close encounter with a tiger shark tends to make one paddle very carefully for the next few hundred yards, but the shark appeared to be every bit as disconcerted by the whole experience as I was.
Oh criminy. Sharks don't kill kayakers. Hypothermia kills kayakers. Also, the Maui thing was just plain old insurance fraud, according to a friend who had some involvement in the case. Last I heard, the wife was believed to be alive and well, probably in Iran.
I will say from personal experience that a close encounter with a tiger shark tends to make one paddle very carefully for the next few hundred yards, but the shark appeared to be every bit as disconcerted by the whole experience as I was.
When dropped from sufficient altitude, sure.
John Steinbeck agrees with B:
"An ocean without nameless monsters is like sleep without dreams."
Assuming he likes dreams, that is.
really i shouldn't be such a killjoy
the bay kayaking is better by all accounts
though of course i know nothing about the kayaking thing
Sharks are nature's ways of culling kayakers and surfers. If BPL and our leader here are worried that they might be culled, they should stay in the bay. But if they're the kind of people who challenge themselves, they should be eaten by sharks.
For the truly humble the prospect of being eaten by a shark would be viewed as an honor -- that my body would be considered worthy to serve as a meal for such a magnificent creature!
For the truly humble the prospect of being eaten by a shark would be viewed as an honor -- that my body would be considered worthy to serve as a meal for such a magnificent creature!
The problem is that the sharks don't tend to eat you. As far as I know they bite you think "What the hell is this?" and then swim away as you bleed to death and/or drown.
the Maui thing was just plain old insurance fraud
Ahahaha. Now that's more like my people.
The problem is that the sharks don't tend to eat you. As far as I know they bite you think "What the hell is this?" and then swim away as you bleed to death and/or drown.
Reminds me of the Far Side cartoon with two crocodiles relaxing on the river bank in post-prandial bliss, with the crushed remains of a couple of kayaks surrounding them. One of them says "I just love those things: crispy on the outside, chewy on the inside."
The problem is that the sharks don't tend to eat you. As far as I know they bite you think "What the hell is this?" and then swim away as you bleed to death and/or drown.
Bummer. Even the truly humble might be upset at the prospect of being chewed up and spit out.
117: Two different Far Side cartoons:
The one with the crocodiles has one of them happily musing, "That was incredible: no horns, no teeth... just soft and pink."
Your dialogue comes from one with two polar bears tearing apart an igloo. [/comic pedant]
aah, that makes sense
i was wondering how the skin can be crispy
119: Right you are. I had a mental image of the Eskimo cartoon in my head as well, but I convinced myself that it was a different caption.
Sharks are nature's ways of culling kayakers and surfers.
No, surfers are nature's way of keeping the sharks entertained so they leave kayakers alone.
Having done most of my sea kayaking on rivers, I find big, tidal kayaking disconcerting. Paddling around the Statue of Liberty was nerve-wracking, and I had a very odd experience on Lake Erie. I went out, it was all wavy and exhilarating, but then I couldn't make any progress back to the beach where I'd started - instead, I was being swept towards cliffs (no exaggeration). I finally figured out how to deal with the waves, and made it back with very tired arms. Went back two days later, and it was smooth as a pond - it was all from wind.
How far out from the beach do oceans get flat enough to paddle normally?
Some of those ocean critters really can kill you. Even if you're just sunbathing on a boat.
Snarky answer: the waves are the normal paddling part. Less snarky answer: depends on the ocean and the wind. And the tide and the current. Some days it's flat calm as soon as you get past the surf. Other days the farther out you go the bigger it gets. Fun stuff. It just takes some time in the boat and the conditions to get used to how everything works. Also, if it's mostly your arms getting tired, you're doing it wrong. A good kayak stroke is driven by core muscles, with the arms mostly there to connect the paddle to the core.
Sorry, falling down on the job. I love Obama, and I will support him fully when he orders the invasion of Wales, Land of Magic.
Someone's cruising for a unicorn horn up the ass.
Not humble enough to actively wish for death by shark, I confess. Though I have occasionally thought that death by wild animal attack might be preferable to other kinds of death.
