to use the indefinite article
I realize you're talking about this NYer, but this is one of my pet peeves about the NYT, except in a different context. I can't stand "Mr. Marshall is married to Elizabeth Stand, the poet" and the like. Either we've never heard of her, in which case she is a poet, or we have, in which case we usually don't need to be reminded of her profession.
The only reason to say "the poet" is to clarify that we are not talking about Elizabeth Stand, the car mechanic. Grrr.
Damn, you've never heard "Constipation Blues" or "Bite It"? Say it ain't so!
I've had a music wonkery question I've been meaning to ask you regarding the alphabetization of ambiguous names. Currently I've adopted the following:
Hawkins, Screamin' Jay
Waters, Muddy
Howlin' Wolf
Snoop Dogg
Doggfather, Tha
Captain Beefheart
I'm not sure by what rules I'd defend these. What say you?
"Tha Doggfather" is the only one that seems to be a problem.
Elizabeth Stand, the car mechanic
Who, it should be said, is just a wizard with mid-90s foreign cars.
w-lfs-n, the blogger, disagrees with Witt, the commenter.
w-lfs-n, the aide to Sen. Clinton, may well agree with Witt, the former figure skater.
There's an obvious (to me) difference between "Mr Marshall is married to Elizabeth Stand, a poet" and "Mr Marshall is married to Elizabeth Stand, the poet"; the latter implies much more notability, or currency, or the like the former. Eg, in the former case, you don't get the impression that there's any reason for you to have heard of Ms Stand, whereas in the latter, you're implicitly being told that maybe she's achieved some degree of fame as a poet.
I dunno, w-lfs-n. I think it's perfectly possible that Witt may have identified the impetus behind the article.
great post and article
i remember i had a beautiful dream after reading Blavatskaya, i was floating in the outer space and the cosmos was really really beautiful, like the IMAX movies
hopefully i'll remember the difference between the articles for some time
Thank you, Mr. Ben w-lfs-n.
good night, all
you're implicitly being told that maybe she's achieved some degree of fame as a poet condescended to. This is a well-known person, but not to you, dumbo, so we'll flag it for you.
Either she's famous or she's not. Most people are not. Being slightly well-known in a small, incestuous social circle is not being famous. Even if most of the people in that circle read the publication in question, most of the readers of the publication will still not be in that social circle.
I'd accept "Gen. Ripper, the Pentagon shill".
I only know anything about this because of the R.E.M. track "Lightnin' Hopkins", which means I don't know anything at all.
Also, to 2: OCLC says Muddy Waters, not Waters, Muddy. Heed the librarians!
the latter implies much more notability, or currency
Or, implies that you ought to know who she is already. But if I already know, I don't need to be told again. And if I don't already know, she's not really famous. It's just the Times trying to make you feel bad for your lack of cultural capital. " ... married to Elizabeth Stand, a well-known poet" would be more acceptable, because it's more clear that they're trying to school you.
Being slightly well-known in a small, incestuous social circle is not being famous.
So is this particularly about the use of the article with a poet?
It doesn't have to be a matter of condescension. One can receive a reminder without being condescended to.
It could also be a useful way of, entirely without scolding, noting the person's rank within his or her calling or whatever. If the article had said "the early rhythm-and-blues star", that wouldn't be scolding you for not knowing, necessarily, but it could well be letting you know that within r&b he's achieved a certain status. You don't care about r&b, no biggie.
LOVE Screamin' Jay Hawkins. His version of "I Love Paris" (on Frenzy, a great album) is definitive. His Wikipedia entry reveals more facets to the man than I ever knew—for example, that he revered Paul Robeson and intended to be an opera singer (what a spectacular Zarastro he would have been!) and that he was once the Alaska middleweight boxing champion.
Why the fuck does The New Yorker waste ink on American Idol? Music journalists everywhere are getting pushed off pages so that newspapers and magazines can run stories on a fucking TV show that doesn't need any publicity because it's on fucking TV. God, that pisses me off. Garbage. I'm glad I never renewed my subscription.
OCLC, eh? I was on the fence about that one, but it seems that the two names have stand alone values that mimic a given name.
Now I'm wondering if there's a place for "tah".
"I Put a Spell on You" is the famous one, but I like "Voodoo" even better. (Portrait of a Man also features his covers of "Heart Attack and Vine" and, yes, "Ol' Man River".)
Oh, and yes, that The New Yorker doesn't recognize that Hawkins deserves the definite article is just further proof that The New Yorker sucks.
(That said I would certainly acknowledge that this device can be, and maybe often is, used to enforce in-groupness.)
But if I already know, I don't need to be told again. And if I don't already know, she's not really famous.
We ignore the second sentence ... if you don't already know, you still might need to know that this so-named person is the same as the so-named person with whom you're already acquainted, no? Even here "so-named person X, a Y", doesn't tell you if so-named person X is the Y.
intended to be an opera singer (what a spectacular Zarastro he would have been!)
I think my dad told me this once, but I only ever half-believed it.
"Heart Attack and Vine" was originally released on Hawkins' Black Music for White People, which I don't own but is clearly the Unfogged-iest album ever made.
I've got to hear Hawkins doing "Heart Attack and Vine".
I heart Gonerill.
16.1: Dude. No.
16.2: Agreed. See the latter part of 14.
That said, I have on occasion been genuinely confused. Robin Williams the tech writer is IIRC a woman and quite well-known in her field. Robin Williams the comic and actor is world-famous. Even so, disambiguation can be helpful in their case (cases?).*
*I kind of just wanted an excuse to use the word "disambiguation." Yay Wikipedia for popularizing it!
Poets form a small, incestuous social circle, is all.
Gonerill couldn't even remember that we're talking about the NYer and not the NYT.
16.2: Agreed. See the latter part of 14.
The latter part of 14 suggest a different way of condescending that's merely more explicit, and does not at all constitute an acknowledgement that the "the occupation" construction need not be condescending at all.
I've got to hear Hawkins doing most songs. I'd even like "God Bless America" then.
I used to work at OCLC. I'm a little sorry I left before they sued the Library Hotel, a move that perfectly summarizes the place's mentality. A colleague characterized the underpaid contractors who do most of the data entry (and likely the ones who decided which vaguely scoped rule to apply to Muddy Waters) as "just your regular cookie eaters."
they sued the Library Hotel
Holy smokes, I thought you were joking. What an absurd case, and how embarrassing for a library-related organization to be so monumentally on the wrong side of a fair-use/IP case.
just your regular cookie eaters
Kinda-related data point suggesting that librarians are more or less as progressive as the society around them: The Library of Congress subject heading for Malcolm X was Little, Malcolm (his birth name). I always thought it was at least partially racism and a kind of paternalism. You can call yourself what you like, lil' guy, but we with the power will dictate where your autiobiography will be found forevermore.
But times change. The LC subject head for Snoop Doggy Dogg is... Snoop Dogg.
Just wait till he converts and changes his name to Shizl al-LBC.
I have a track from Probe Is Turning On the People! of SCJ doing "Orange-Colored Sky."
Gonerill couldn't even remember that we're talking about the NYer, the magazine, and not the NYT, the newspaper.
If you thought 33 was funny, then it was by me.
Otherwise:
Try to be funnier, anonymous!
Fuck is it late back east. Good night.
This is house style at the Economist, with no exceptions, not even for Bill Clinton, the American President or Mozart, the composer.
Antarctica, penguin-studded mega-continent. Bethlehem, legendary birthplace of Jesus Christ.
You jest, but you are obviously unaware of Bethlehem, PA? Again: Disambiguation, baby!
Antarctica, song by John Cale.
I have a horrible fear that most people who have heard "I Put a Spell on You" deez days associate it with Nina Simone. Not that there's anything wrong with Nina Simone.
That's Nina Simone, the American singer, right?
It's also house style on Aaronovitch Watch (Incorporating "World of Decency") to ensure that no confusion is made between Alan Johnson, the minister and Alan "Not The Minister" Johnson, the college lecture and apostle of British war-liberalism.
to use the indefinite article
Or should it be "to use an indefinite article?" I seem to find confusion (see 5.71 vs. 15.9), where I might have hoped for clarity. (Although perhaps they are carefully distinguishing between "indefinite article", the grammatical construct, and "indefinite article", the descriptor for particular words. )
29: I am still (quietly) waging my one-man campaign to get arts writers and editors to stop writing sentences like "Rapper Ice-T (Tracy Marrow) is condemned to play police officers for the rest of his career." If it's a news story, I can see some justification for including the birth name, but when do you ever see a non-hip hop entertainer referred to that way? "Björk (Guðmundsdóttir) attended the premiere with her friend Tom Cruise (Thomas Cruise Mapother IV)" Not bloody likely.
Also, remember how the Punch house style was to write things like: "Mr. Steve Gutenberg, the tragedian, attended the premiere with his friend Mr. David Spade, the tragedian."? I always thought that was funny.
Somewhere I have a Screaming Jay CD called "Black Music for White People" which features a picture of Hawkins with a bone in his nose, holding a spear on one side and a white woman on the other.
and likely the ones who decided which vaguely scoped rule to apply to Muddy Waters
I'm always looking for more reasons to hate OCLC, but this rule--it's AACR2 22.11: Entry Under Phrase--was adopted by the LOC.
"Enter in direct order a name that consists of a phrase or appellation that does not contain a forename.
Also enter in direct order a phrase that consists of a forename or forenames preceded by words other than a term of address or a title of position or office. Make a reference from the forename(s) followed by the initial word(s).
If, however, such a name has the appearance of a forename, forenames, or initials, and a surname, enter under the pseudosurname. Refer from the name in direct order."
Heed the LOC!
Speaking of barbarisms, Jeff Zucker's remark that American Idol may be the "most impactful show in the history of television" makes me want to kill.
The Library of Congress subject heading for Malcolm X was Little, Malcolm (his birth name).
In that case consistency demands "Morganfield, McKinley". Or were the cookie eaters so ignorant they couldn't find out Muddy's birth name?
Hey, everybody, carbon fiber leg boy is getting a shot at the Olympics!
I think that's ridiculous. He should put an outboard motor on himself and enter for the single sculls, while he's at it.
Maybe he could enter equestrian events riding a motorcycle.
Bryan Ferry did a cover of "I Put a Spell on You", which on the face of it is a patently absurd idea, but somehow he makes it work okay. He's good at the unlikely cover.
Which version did they sell in Starbucks?
The Library of Congress subject heading for Malcolm X was Little, Malcolm (his birth name).
Malcolm X's current LCSH is "X, Malcolm, 1925-1965." "X" is treated as his surname, whereas "Muddy Waters" is treated as a phrase, like Poor Richard, or Calamity Jane, or Boy George. "Muddy Waters" is the subject heading instead of "Morganfield, McKinley" because "Muddy Waters" is the name he produced (most of) his work under.
In that case consistency demands
The Library of Congress laughs at your puny demands for consistency!
54: Eh, her vocals are a little weak.
"Muddy Waters" didn't want people to know that he was Jewish.
There were at least two Howlin Wolves, as I understand.
58. Chester Burnett and who else? Multiple Sonny Boy Williamsons, certainly.
There's only one New Jersey Slim, though, AFAIK.
60:
Doesnt she sing with the Undulating Unionistas?
"Enter in direct order a name that consists of a phrase or appellation that does not contain a forename.
My thinking on this is that since people called him Muddy (didn't they?) it's unclear how to treat the name as a whole. This works just fine for Howlin' Wolf; no one called him "Howlin'".
58: "Muddy Waters, the Jewish bluesman" or "Muddy Waters, a Jewish bluesman?"
2: I thought Tha Doggfather was just the title of Snoop [Doggy] Dogg's sophomore album.
(And as you know, within a single artist's oeuvre, the correct ordering is chronological by release date.)
61: That's Ululating Unionistas, Will. Get your mind out of the gutter.
67: Thinking about MILFs now? Geez, Will, try a cold shower.
Yes, Will, you should be thinking about actresses and songstresses in the flower of their youth.
But to use the indefinite article--O cruel ignominy! it's as much as to assert that no one knows who Hawkins is. Can this be true? Surely not.
Of course not. Everyone has heard of him. It's just that I can hardly believe he could sing well with that voder-vocoder he has to use.
One of my favorite "the XXX" was in the NY Timesin 2000. They ran a letter from Frank Gehry and under his name the identified him this way: The writer is the architect.
71: I think they should have put it:
The writer is the "architect".
My thinking on this is that since people called him Muddy (didn't they?) it's unclear how to treat the name as a whole.
A faction at the LOC made exactly this point. They were crushed ruthlessly.
Ted Hawkins, the former Venice Beach street musician, is another Hawkins with a great voice. His version of Webb Pierce's iconic "There Stands the Glass" is definitive (I can't find a linkable recording, so listen to this guy instead).
I still fondly recall a Norton anthology that actually glossed a reference to "Paris" in a poem with the helpful "a city in France". Making it "the city in France" wouldn't help at all, though.
Personally, I like to think of Paris as "the Paris of France", having previously lived in a place that liked to call itself "the Paris of the Piedmont"
Paris: A. Hilton. B. Latsis. C. City in France. D. City in Texas. E. Mythological figure. F. Place where plaster is made.
I saw Screamin' Jay Hawkins live. Sadly, he was not very good. "i put a spell on you" is a very good song though.